Psa about DSP. This is a must read
Thread Starter
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Elite HDF Member
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 3,789
Likes: 277
From: Hawkeye state
When an amp or head unit has unlimited xover capabilities, oem input summing, individual channel level control in and out, fully independent eq from each channel and output then moot point is not true by any means. Just because one can not get 100% exact optimization doesn't qualify as near moot, as I bet you can get close to 80-90%. Same relationship to tuning a bike using auto tune and trying to hit all the cells and data collection vs a dyno tune. You benefit in many ways. Can all that equipment make it even 1 step better ? Maybe, but guess what happens riding down the hwy at 80 and you deviate from optimal? It is what it is. The creature features of the dsp are the reason for some systems will benefit and come alive. Damn engineers. Follow the kiss method.
Grand HDF Member
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 3,516
Likes: 1,994
From: Vancouver BC
I really don't think it's overkill. Tuning your audio is incredibly similar to tuning a new enginge. You can tune by ear or you can toss it on a dyno and graph the output in order to make the necessary power changes throughout its operating band.
The equipment I've outlined can be had for well under $500 and sometimes much, much less, it really should be part of every audio installer's bag of tools. I have to head off to work now but I would like to delve deeper into this and explain to folks how simple it is to aquire and use these tools. I'll check back in a little later with a writeup on where to get the test and measuring eqpt and how to use it. It really is simple and not black magic, it's just that no-one's taken the time to assemble the necessary info and equipment sources. Give me a bit of time and I'll write a little treatise on it. If you have the capability to install a stereo then I'll show you how to tune it like an audio engineer, it's that easy.
The equipment I've outlined can be had for well under $500 and sometimes much, much less, it really should be part of every audio installer's bag of tools. I have to head off to work now but I would like to delve deeper into this and explain to folks how simple it is to aquire and use these tools. I'll check back in a little later with a writeup on where to get the test and measuring eqpt and how to use it. It really is simple and not black magic, it's just that no-one's taken the time to assemble the necessary info and equipment sources. Give me a bit of time and I'll write a little treatise on it. If you have the capability to install a stereo then I'll show you how to tune it like an audio engineer, it's that easy.
Thread Starter
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Elite HDF Member
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 3,789
Likes: 277
From: Hawkeye state
I really don't think it's overkill. Tuning your audio is incredibly similar to tuning a new enginge. You can tune by ear or you can toss it on a dyno and graph the output in order to make the necessary power changes throughout its operating band.
The equipment I've outlined can be had for well under $500 and sometimes much, much less, it really should be part of every audio installer's bag of tools. I have to head off to work now but I would like to delve deeper into this and explain to folks how simple it is to aquire and use these tools. I'll check back in a little later with a writeup on where to get the test and measuring eqpt and how to use it. It really is simple and not black magic, it's just that no-one's taken the time to assemble the necessary info and equipment sources. Give me a bit of time and I'll write a little treatise on it. If you have the capability to install a stereo then I'll show you how to tune it like an audio engineer, it's that easy.
The equipment I've outlined can be had for well under $500 and sometimes much, much less, it really should be part of every audio installer's bag of tools. I have to head off to work now but I would like to delve deeper into this and explain to folks how simple it is to aquire and use these tools. I'll check back in a little later with a writeup on where to get the test and measuring eqpt and how to use it. It really is simple and not black magic, it's just that no-one's taken the time to assemble the necessary info and equipment sources. Give me a bit of time and I'll write a little treatise on it. If you have the capability to install a stereo then I'll show you how to tune it like an audio engineer, it's that easy.
Tourer
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 432
Likes: 10
From: Miami/FL
Is there any reason why the general preference is the PSM over the TWK88 other than size, and the fact that the lay out of the connectors on the PSM makes it easier to fit on the bike?
Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 6,446
Likes: 873
From: TEXAS
Originally Posted by flcusat
Is there any reason why the general preference is the PSM over the TWK88 other than size, and the fact that the lay out of the connectors on the PSM makes it easier to fit on the bike?
The other part of the JL concern is whether the JL Fix is required as an interface for the TWK and when.
T.
Last edited by Tailwind; Jul 21, 2017 at 09:14 AM.
Tourer
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 432
Likes: 10
From: Miami/FL
I would bet that the JL products are far superior but space being a top priority, I went w the ARC. Serves its purpose very well but my boys running the JLs are getting some damn good performance.
The other part of the JL concern is whether the JL Fix is required as an interface for the TWK and when.
T.
The other part of the JL concern is whether the JL Fix is required as an interface for the TWK and when.
T.
I was also thinking about the use with an aftermarket HU.
Banned
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 1,177
Likes: 196
From: Miami, FL
I've used the Fix, the Twk and PSM.....we're dealers for both Arc and JL. The PSM is smaller and much easier to fit places. Also the EQ while only 7 bands has user defined frequency bands. Downside is that it's only 6 channels but there's there just about enough on there to make it a great tool with size and options. The Twk is bigger but also has 8 channels and that's a HUGE plus. The tuning options are similar but the EQ has more bands but not user defined. It's an awesome unit if you have the space and you don't need a Fix to you use it. The Fix is a very bland unit when it comes to tuning...it flattens the signal and provides a basic EQ for four channels.
Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 6,446
Likes: 873
From: TEXAS
Originally Posted by BaggerAudioLab
I've used the Fix, the Twk and PSM.....we're dealers for both Arc and JL. The PSM is smaller and much easier to fit places. Also the EQ while only 7 bands has user defined frequency bands. Downside is that it's only 6 channels but there's there just about enough on there to make it a great tool with size and options. The Twk is bigger but also has 8 channels and that's a HUGE plus. The tuning options are similar but the EQ has more bands but not user defined. It's an awesome unit if you have the space and you don't need a Fix to you use it. The Fix is a very bland unit when it comes to tuning...it flattens the signal and provides a basic EQ for four channels.
T
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Banned
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 1,177
Likes: 196
From: Miami, FL
So to clarify....you don't "need" the Fix to use a Twk. You can use the Twk just like you use the Arc PSM and correct the crappy signal with your own tuning. If you run JUST the Fix, yeah it works like the best of the best line leveler with some EQ options but really just for 2 sets of speakers. You THEN need the TWK to unleash 8 channels of awesome DSP-ness.
We used the Fix on a bad *** hooked up T-Rex Campagna running subs and all the bells and whistles. In the end we ripped it out and used a PSM. Go with what you know.
We used the Fix on a bad *** hooked up T-Rex Campagna running subs and all the bells and whistles. In the end we ripped it out and used a PSM. Go with what you know.
Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 6,446
Likes: 873
From: TEXAS
Originally Posted by BaggerAudioLab
So to clarify....you don't "need" the Fix to use a Twk. You can use the Twk just like you use the Arc PSM and correct the crappy signal with your own tuning. If you run JUST the Fix, yeah it works like the best of the best line leveler with some EQ options but really just for 2 sets of speakers. You THEN need the TWK to unleash 8 channels of awesome DSP-ness.
We used the Fix on a bad *** hooked up T-Rex Campagna running subs and all the bells and whistles. In the end we ripped it out and used a PSM. Go with what you know.
We used the Fix on a bad *** hooked up T-Rex Campagna running subs and all the bells and whistles. In the end we ripped it out and used a PSM. Go with what you know.
T.