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Finally had a sunny and warm(ish) day here, so took off work early to install the Arlen Ness Big Brake Kit on my '03 Superglide. Actually a pretty easy install - maybe an hour total. Only tricky bit was getting the caliper installed, since I couldn't get it to slide on the disc once the disk was installed, so loosened the disc bolts to get it to rock out, slipped the caliper on and then tightened the disc back down. The disc looks huge compared to the stocker. Put a pic below for comparison.
Now the question - The front brake was mushy when I bought the bike. I flushed the fluid with DOT5 and bled the system, but it never got what I would call "Harley firm" like the others I've ridden. I didn't really mind as I'm used to Jap bikes that have more travel in the brake lever which I actually prefer for better modulation, but was still planning on rebuilding the front master cylinder in the spring. Anyway,... to get the caliper on I had to spread the pads. Low and behold the the front brake is now totally firm, much less lever travel than before - feels like my wife's Sporty. What gives?
Note that the pads are probably original and the material is pretty thin after 15K+ miles on the odo. Haven't mic'd the disc thicknesses, so don't know if the pads are as close with the new disc as the old, but the disc thicknesses wasn't something so different that I noticed it during install.
Might as well give a ride impression. Initially I couldn't tell much difference, especially with the much firmer brake lever. Makes kind of an obnoxious sound like a fly buzzing compared to the stock disc.
After I got used to the new feel of the lever, I could tell that the new setup has MUCH stronger brakes than the stock brake setup. Before, the bike felt like a 'rear braker' - needed a lot of rear brake compared to my Jap bikes.
I wouldn't say these brakes are like Jap sportbike strong, but I realized I was only using the rear brake to settle the chassis and using the front brake to do most of the braking. Other than the buzzy sound using the brakes at low speed, I don't think there's a bad thing to say. The Ness BBK is a big improvement overall and I'm looking forward to more riding with it.
I would never reuse the old brake pads when installing a new rotor. I always felt it would be better for new pads to get broken in with a new rotor, so any wear or unevenness would not be affecting on the new rotor.
Might as well give a ride impression. Initially I couldn't tell much difference, especially with the much firmer brake lever. Makes kind of an obnoxious sound like a fly buzzing compared to the stock disc.
Other than the buzzy sound using the brakes at low speed, I don't think there's a bad thing to say.
I rode my buddy's Superglide, just around the neighborhood, who has a BBK also (I was test riding it after we put new risers and bars and straightened the trees after a low speed doozy he had) I noticed the noise as well and it seriously bothered me. Thought one of his bearings went bad from the crash or something. Why does it make that noise? I was contemplating getting one, but that noise is a bit off-putting. Anyone else have that sound or do something to get rid of it?
Edit: To clarify, it made a little noise without grabbing brakes, and much more when grabbing it.
I rode my buddy's Superglide, just around the neighborhood, who has a BBK also (I was test riding it after we put new risers and bars and straightened the trees after a low speed doozy he had) I noticed the noise as well and it seriously bothered me. Thought one of his bearings went bad from the crash or something. Why does it make that noise? I was contemplating getting one, but that noise is a bit off-putting. Anyone else have that sound or do something to get rid of it?
Edit: To clarify, it made a little noise without grabbing brakes, and much more when grabbing it.
Mine has that a bit. Im not using the BBK, but I do have 13 rotors that the utside diameter is scalloped. I think the noise is due to airflow around these notches and is accentuated when the airflow is disturbed more during brake application.
I rode my buddy's Superglide, just around the neighborhood, who has a BBK also (I was test riding it after we put new risers and bars and straightened the trees after a low speed doozy he had) I noticed the noise as well and it seriously bothered me. Thought one of his bearings went bad from the crash or something. Why does it make that noise? I was contemplating getting one, but that noise is a bit off-putting. Anyone else have that sound or do something to get rid of it?
Edit: To clarify, it made a little noise without grabbing brakes, and much more when grabbing it.
Mine makes the noise when applying the brakes. I believe it has to do with the undulation in the rotor.
If it's making the noise without applying the brakes they're probably dragging. I had to shim my caliper so they wouldn't drag.
I rode my buddy's Superglide, just around the neighborhood, who has a BBK also (I was test riding it after we put new risers and bars and straightened the trees after a low speed doozy he had) I noticed the noise as well and it seriously bothered me. Thought one of his bearings went bad from the crash or something. Why does it make that noise? I was contemplating getting one, but that noise is a bit off-putting. Anyone else have that sound or do something to get rid of it?
Edit: To clarify, it made a little noise without grabbing brakes, and much more when grabbing it.
Yeah, even light application of the brakes produces that 'fly buzzing' sound.
I had a 1985 Suzuki GS700E (my first new bike ever, and last of the Zuk sport bikes before the Gixxer series), and it made a similar noise - sounded like Crickets - so she got named "Cricket" of course!
Anyway, I suspect the "buzzy flies" sound of the Ness BBK is due to either the hole pattern drilled into the disk or - more likely - the wavy edge. Either way, I'm sure I'll get used to it, and that noise is totally worth it for the improved braking this kit gives. Two thumbs up, IMO!
Back to my question... Somewhere in my research I found something about the HD brakes being "reset' by pushing the pads back. Was hoping someone here could point me back to it or explain the effect.
Anyway, before the brakes were not bad, just a lot of lever 'softness', but they still grabbed fine without bottoming the lever (unlike a bad master cylinder). Since pushing the pads back and installing the new disc, the front feels like a typical modern Harley brake, meaning totally effective but too firm by half.
UPDATE: Since I've been drinking and I'm not getting laid anyway, I just went out and measured the disc thicknesses; Stock disc is 0.186" thick, and the new Ness disk is 0.230", So difference is 44 thousandths. Not a ton, but not insignificant. Like I said, the firmer brake feel may be due to the reduced piston displacement at the brake caliper with the new disc.
I plan on ordering new pads now that I saw how thin my current stock pads are. Will do that in the spring.
Just wondering why the front brake went from sort of soft to typical HD firm from just pushing back the pads with a thicker rotor. Doesn't really make sense to me, but I do remember this being mentioned when researching the soft brakes on my bike.
Finally, kingglide549. you're right, it's hard to get brakes with the silicone DOT5 to get as firm as the DOT3/4 glycol fluid, but to me the silicone isn't bad and holds up way better (re. water contamination) compared to the glycol (as long as the seals will take the silicone, which HD seals are designed for).
The rubber seals are all that pull the piston away from the disk. As the pads wear, the piston is supposed to move farther out, through the seal, so that the seal then retracts it the same amount. I suppose it's possible that the seals were stuck to the pistons so your pistons were returning farther than normal, and when you pushed them back to accommodate the thicker disk, they went back to normal.
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Ness Big Brake + general brake question
