Please help an idiot with Stage 1!
Elite HDF Member
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,722
Likes: 7
RE: Please help an idiot with Stage 1!
ORIGINAL: thrillseeker
is the device absolutely necessary, or will the O2 sensors suffice?
is the device absolutely necessary, or will the O2 sensors suffice?
That's the million dollar question and it has been discussed and debated here many times. \\; The computer on the EFI bikes will only adjust so far, first of all. \\; And, even then, they will only adjust back to the factory settings which are already on the lean side. \\; There doesn't seem to ever be a consensus on this subject and there are many different ways to do the fuel management side of the stage 1 (SE download/remap, IED's, fuelpak, T-Max, PCIII, SERT, etc.). \\; I think a lot depends on how your bike was set when it left the factory, the environment you ride in, the way you ride, and the extent of the stage 1 mods. \\; There may be RPM ranges in which the bike will adjust fine and if you always ride within those ranges, it's okay. \\; And there may be RPM ranges where the bike can't fully adjust and you are slowly damaging your motor by running it too lean. \\; There is tons of information on this topic if you do a search but I would bet it would only serve to confuse you even more and not answer your question. \\; I look at it as - it's better to have it and not need it than vice versa.
Elite HDF Member
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 4,579
Likes: 10
From: S.E. MO
RE: Please help an idiot with Stage 1!
ORIGINAL: thrillseeker
 \\;\\\\\\;
If you are doing a basic stage I, I thought the O2 sensors were supposed to be adequate for adjusting the fuel mixture?????? \\;\\\\\\; Now I realize an add on device (like my PCIII for my '05 without O2 sensors) will squeeze every little bit of HP/TQ possible - BUT, for the sake of accuracy, is the device absolutely necessary, or will the O2 sensors suffice?
 \\;\\\\\\;
If you are doing a basic stage I, I thought the O2 sensors were supposed to be adequate for adjusting the fuel mixture?????? \\;\\\\\\; Now I realize an add on device (like my PCIII for my '05 without O2 sensors) will squeeze every little bit of HP/TQ possible - BUT, for the sake of accuracy, is the device absolutely necessary, or will the O2 sensors suffice?
O2 sensors help adjust some but what most modern cars have is a Mass air flow sensor, this is what adjusts the fuel more and why you dont need add on units for them. The harleys have have o2 sensors but not a mass air flow sensor.
Road Warrior
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,302
Likes: 0
From: SW Corner of NW Corner
RE: Please help an idiot with Stage 1!
hmmm, interesting. \\;
 \\;
With just that little bit of knowledge, when it is time for me to buy a newer bike, I would probably just do what I have already done.... Stage I (or II) and the PCIII. \\; That has worked well for me so far, so why try to fix it.
 \\;
OhAte - now you get to ponder the 37,000 fuel management options
 \\; \\; When I bought my '05, there were only a couple options to choose from. \\; From experience, I would do what I have done before... which is the PCIII... plus, I know my local tuner is "hip" to the PC world. \\; I think that is an important factore when it comes to fuel managment and dyno tunes.... what is your local dyno tuner most comfortable with? \\; ... good advice would be to use what they like. \\; Of course, my dyno tuner is the dealer, but they prefer the PCIII. \\; I think the general rule is that a dealer will want to sell you the SE Race Tuner. \\; Not only will it cost more, but their tuner may not even be qualified to use it correctly (trained and qualified are two different things BTW). \\; But, my dealer is usually the excpetion to the rule, they also push Redline oils over Syn3, and sell Metz tires just as cheap as anyone else.
 \\;
With just that little bit of knowledge, when it is time for me to buy a newer bike, I would probably just do what I have already done.... Stage I (or II) and the PCIII. \\; That has worked well for me so far, so why try to fix it.
 \\;
OhAte - now you get to ponder the 37,000 fuel management options
 \\; \\; When I bought my '05, there were only a couple options to choose from. \\; From experience, I would do what I have done before... which is the PCIII... plus, I know my local tuner is "hip" to the PC world. \\; I think that is an important factore when it comes to fuel managment and dyno tunes.... what is your local dyno tuner most comfortable with? \\; ... good advice would be to use what they like. \\; Of course, my dyno tuner is the dealer, but they prefer the PCIII. \\; I think the general rule is that a dealer will want to sell you the SE Race Tuner. \\; Not only will it cost more, but their tuner may not even be qualified to use it correctly (trained and qualified are two different things BTW). \\; But, my dealer is usually the excpetion to the rule, they also push Redline oils over Syn3, and sell Metz tires just as cheap as anyone else.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
Joker1200
Exhaust System Topics
2
Jul 10, 2008 04:32 AM
DeuceRyder
Softail Models
14
Jun 10, 2008 09:02 PM
