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93 Ultra Classic Breathing Issues

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Old Jul 14, 2020 | 07:24 PM
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Default 93 Ultra Classic Breathing Issues

Hello again,

Seems my list of issues never seems to stop. This bike is newer to me, and I have had a host of issue which I have been going through one by one and solving. Also of note is this is my first ever Harley and she was a bit of a basket case when I got her so bare with me. I do have a repair manual which I have been referencing but some topics aren't as well cover in it as well as some illustration i find rather confusing.

The motorcycle is relatively stock from what I can tell. It is stilling running the stock Harley CV Carb, however it has a washable cloth filter (K and N round style) instead of the stock style and those uses a different backing plate.

This time I'm having a engine breathing issue I believe. I month ago, I lost the dipstick while riding and only recently had time to installed a new one . After making sure all fluid level where within their ranges, the motorcycle was fired up and let run to warm up. After a little time I noticed the bike was having a hard time keeping idle but I just thought it was because it was cold. After getting my gear together and getting ready to leave I heard a loud pop, and watched the dip stick eject itself from the filler neck. I shut the bike down and check everything. While checking I found engine oil level was still within range for being warm ( higher side but still in the range). So I cleaned the dipstick off well and put it back in place. Firing up the bike again, I watched the dipstick. Sure enough it popped out again. After one more check I confirmed the issue for a third time. I noted that when I pulled the dipstick out while the bike was warm and running, not only was it able to idle correctly again but the oil pressure was slightly lower yet still well within its range. I did a quick check on the google machine and found that some people said that over filling the engine oil would cause this issue. So I performed an engine oil change making sure to fill the engine to the lower end of the scale. Tested the machine and like clock work the dipstick popped out again. I decided to run the bike and hold my finger over what I figured was the " Breather port" at the top of the jugs, on the carb side of the bike. While running it, I noted no pressure was felt, no sucking or blowing. Thinking that was strange, I removed the bolt to find blind holes with regular bolts in them. This is where my confusion really started to peak because I though these engines where head breathers. I visually searched the engine and could not find anywhere that would vent crank case pressure out to atmosphere. Looking through My repair manual, I found what I think is a breather screen and pulled it and its spring. I found these on the crank case where the cam and breather gear would be under a flat head plug. The screen seemed clean and the spring(though strange looking) was in one piece. I washed them down thoroughly, replaced the o-ring on the plug and re-installed. This is where my diagnoses has ended.

Anyone with any information on where this engine breaths through and how it vents to atmosphere would be much appreciate. One better would be if someone had or took photos of the outer hose routing so I could check my engine's. As I stated above, the illustration in my repair manual are rather confusing.

Thanks for your time.
 

Last edited by Zannarack; Jul 14, 2020 at 07:41 PM.
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Old Jul 14, 2020 | 10:50 PM
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Engine oil filter

Engine oil pump

Under side of motorcycle
 
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Old Jul 15, 2020 | 09:28 AM
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Huge paragraphs of jammed together sentences are difficult to read, and make it hard to keep track of what is being described.

Perform a compression test, and a leak down test.

You may have a plugged or collapsing hose.

Think about restoring the oil line setup and going back to rubber hose of the proper type (what you have now is certainly not aesthetically pleasing, especially the mishmash of fittings).
 

Last edited by Dan89FLSTC; Jul 15, 2020 at 09:29 AM.
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Old Jul 15, 2020 | 12:39 PM
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Right on point again Dan.
What manual are you using? Hopefully not Clymer or Haynes.
 
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Old Jul 15, 2020 | 01:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Beemervet
Right on point again Dan.
What manual are you using? Hopefully not Clymer or Haynes.
The manual I have is a Clymer.
 
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Old Jul 15, 2020 | 02:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Dan89FLSTC
Huge paragraphs of jammed together sentences are difficult to read, and make it hard to keep track of what is being described.

Perform a compression test, and a leak down test.

You may have a plugged or collapsing hose.

Think about restoring the oil line setup and going back to rubber hose of the proper type (what you have now is certainly not aesthetically pleasing, especially the mishmash of fittings).
I'm don't know what the stock oil line set up is suppose to be. I have check my manual but the way its illustrated has me very confused. This is basically how I received the motorcycle. I did changed to the stainless steel lines but that was due to the old oil lines starting to fail. When swapping I changed one line at a time.
 
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Old Jul 15, 2020 | 02:18 PM
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93 should be head breather. You stated blind holes in heads, and some what of a basket case.

My guess from those clues is not original engine/ original heads. Might look at an earlier than 93 oiling diagram/ breather route from the case.
 
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Old Jul 15, 2020 | 02:27 PM
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Have you checked your breather bolts in the heads? 1993 top breather should have hollow breather bolts in the heads
 
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Old Jul 15, 2020 | 02:27 PM
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I guess a summery is in order.

Issue: Dipstick is blowing out of filler neck. Issue has been verified.

Trouble shooting: Performed engine oil service, filling engine on low side. Tested and issue still present. Checked " Breather ports" where banjo bolts would be by Carb on jugs. Found no ports, just blind holes. Inspect engine for any other breather port. Could not see any.

Theory: Oil/ breather hoses are run incorrectly. Blow by gas have no exit from engine, those building up in oil tank and engine causing dip stick to get pushed out.

Vitals: Engine is high mile so blow by is very much pressent. Oil pressure when warm is around 12 psi as indicated on the dash cluster gauge. Bike starts well hot and cold. Holds idle and warms evenly. On start up it smokes a little but clears up when warm. Will perform compression test and leak down soon but pretty sure compression isn't high.

Information required: A clear source for how the engine oil lines/ Breather lines are routed on a 93 Electra Glide Ultra Classic. Also any information on where this engine is suppose to vent crank case gasses from as I was under the impression it was through banjo bolts in the jogs.

Sorry for any confusion I may have cause and again thank you for your time and your help.
 
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Old Jul 15, 2020 | 02:29 PM
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It just dawned on me that this is a head breather engine...

Are the breather openings clear?

The engine breathes through hollow bolts that hold the air filter backing plate on.

You may need to remove the rocker boxes and replace the umbrella valves.

But do the compression and leak down checks first, make sure the issue isn`t simply a worn out top end.

The hoses in your pic are:

A= Oil supply from bottom of oil tank to oil pump.

C= Oil from pump to oil filter

B= Oil return from filter back to tank.

The hose just beneath the bracket is the oil tank vent hose (crankcase to oil tank).



 
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