Ultima motors?
Road Captain
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 635
Likes: 388
From: Philadelphia Northeast
I've put 107" into my '98 EG in 2011. It's under third owner after me, now 40k+ miles on this engine and still running strong. Only issue was ignition module and coil on my first year. Replaced with Daytona. Transmission is Ultima too, BTW.
HDF Community Team
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 1,434
Likes: 800
From: Colorado
120/127 is a drop in for evo frame, (120 is a square set up), motor goes for about $4K on amazon/comes with carb so play and plug from the start, and about all you need to do is just swap the lifters out to a set of Johnson's and be done with it.
http://www.ultimaproducts.com/120engine127.html
Myself, since am machine shop geared up to rebuild a Evo motor to start with, just rebuild the stock motor is not much money when you are not farming out all the machining to start with, verse the $5K~$6k it costs to have someone else rebuild the motor isntead.
Plus, when it all said and done, you do have the OEM rebuilt motor back in the bike in the end.
So yes, no replacement for displacement if your two up/fully loaded down, and trying to climb up a building wall in top gear, but how often are you going to be pushing the bike over 135mph, to justify the added HP on a Evo in the first place for that mind set instead.
http://www.ultimaproducts.com/120engine127.html
Myself, since am machine shop geared up to rebuild a Evo motor to start with, just rebuild the stock motor is not much money when you are not farming out all the machining to start with, verse the $5K~$6k it costs to have someone else rebuild the motor isntead.
Plus, when it all said and done, you do have the OEM rebuilt motor back in the bike in the end.
So yes, no replacement for displacement if your two up/fully loaded down, and trying to climb up a building wall in top gear, but how often are you going to be pushing the bike over 135mph, to justify the added HP on a Evo in the first place for that mind set instead.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 5,079
Likes: 2,151
From: Ohio
White bike has a 127" in it, bought it used cheap but pulled the heads and had smoked cylinders. Rebore with new pistons lasted a season losing a crank pin with the metal taking out cylinders again. Installed a new flywheel assembly, rebore with new pistons again sending the heads to John Sachs for porting plus lowering CC's raising the compression to 10.8-1, engine was stupid strong but became a heat monster eventually having a valve seat loosen and caught it before damage. John knew the GM at Ultima and he sent me new heads with a gasket kit, this was a used engine most likely having the chit ran out of it by previous owner so can't condemn the name by history and modifications.
Put the 127" engine back together with new heads cleaned up, stock compression, softer S&S 640 cam, S&S lifters, S&S oil pump, with the low mile Ultima flywheel, have not had any issues with it for the last 8 years, good street manors, dependable riding on all day rides. It's done a good job when used as designed and rode in normal riding conditions but when bikes drop the hammer it still see's some giddy up but stay away from the rev limiter.
Note: John Sachs also overbored the carb slowing air speed down passing thru the throat allowing good idle and low speed characteristics but still has the leave this one alone carb idle.
Put the 127" engine back together with new heads cleaned up, stock compression, softer S&S 640 cam, S&S lifters, S&S oil pump, with the low mile Ultima flywheel, have not had any issues with it for the last 8 years, good street manors, dependable riding on all day rides. It's done a good job when used as designed and rode in normal riding conditions but when bikes drop the hammer it still see's some giddy up but stay away from the rev limiter.
Note: John Sachs also overbored the carb slowing air speed down passing thru the throat allowing good idle and low speed characteristics but still has the leave this one alone carb idle.
Last edited by 1997bagger; Oct 12, 2023 at 10:03 PM.
Grand HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2022
Posts: 4,418
Likes: 3,823
From: Florida
White bike has a 127" in it, bought it used cheap but pulled the heads and had smoked cylinders. Rebore with new pistons lasted a season losing a crank pin with the metal taking out cylinders again. Installed a new flywheel assembly, rebore with new pistons again sending the heads to John Sachs for porting plus lowering CC's raising the compression to 10.8-1, engine was stupid strong but became a heat monster eventually having a valve seat loosen and caught it before damage. John knew the GM at Ultima and he sent me new heads with a gasket kit, this was a used engine most likely having the chit ran out of it by previous owner so can't condemn the name by history and modifications.
Put the 127" engine back together with new heads cleaned up, stock compression, softer S&S 640 cam, S&S lifters, S&S oil pump, with the low mile Ultima flywheel, have not had any issues with it for the last 8 years, good street manors, dependable riding on all day rides. It's done a good job when used as designed and rode in normal riding conditions but when bikes drop the hammer it still see's some giddy up but stay away from the rev limiter.
Note: John Sachs also overbored the carb slowing air speed down passing thru the throat allowing good idle and low speed characteristics but still has the leave this one alone carb idle.
Put the 127" engine back together with new heads cleaned up, stock compression, softer S&S 640 cam, S&S lifters, S&S oil pump, with the low mile Ultima flywheel, have not had any issues with it for the last 8 years, good street manors, dependable riding on all day rides. It's done a good job when used as designed and rode in normal riding conditions but when bikes drop the hammer it still see's some giddy up but stay away from the rev limiter.
Note: John Sachs also overbored the carb slowing air speed down passing thru the throat allowing good idle and low speed characteristics but still has the leave this one alone carb idle.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 19,894
Likes: 8,002
From: poway
About 2011 or 2012 I assembled a 127 for a guy. The only thing we did different was lifters and a 3 angle valve job and he made the advertised hp easy. I moved and lost track, don’t know if he’s still street/strip but last I knew it was running great.
I just bought another un assembled 127 and blue printed it and installed it in my softail. I haven’t fired it yet but everything looked good. Next year I’ll replace the rockers and have the heads ported and a new valve job… but I’m pretty confident it will get me into the 10’s likely 140 square. I’m gonna run my bored out G carb and I have two sets of exhaust to try, Bassani pro-streets and hooker three step drags. After the 1000 mile break in I’ll do some track and dyno to see what’s up.
I also messed with a 96” shovel from them. Put a different evo cam in it and he made about 100 square.. less than my 93” but still pretty remarkable from a crate motor.
The un assembled 120-127 cost almost the same as the assembled but I wanted peace of mind and love doing it myself.
snipped pic of nice bike.
I just bought another un assembled 127 and blue printed it and installed it in my softail. I haven’t fired it yet but everything looked good. Next year I’ll replace the rockers and have the heads ported and a new valve job… but I’m pretty confident it will get me into the 10’s likely 140 square. I’m gonna run my bored out G carb and I have two sets of exhaust to try, Bassani pro-streets and hooker three step drags. After the 1000 mile break in I’ll do some track and dyno to see what’s up.
I also messed with a 96” shovel from them. Put a different evo cam in it and he made about 100 square.. less than my 93” but still pretty remarkable from a crate motor.
The un assembled 120-127 cost almost the same as the assembled but I wanted peace of mind and love doing it myself.
snipped pic of nice bike.
Last edited by Max Headflow; Oct 13, 2023 at 10:59 AM. Reason: ??
Grand HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2022
Posts: 4,418
Likes: 3,823
From: Florida
A buddy of mine services, assembles and races these motors. He says a lot of guys say to replace the lifters, some push rods because both show ware early.. but he says over the years hes learned its really the rockers causing the issues. He defiantly uses the upper rpm band and would know. So Im completely going on his advise on that.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 19,894
Likes: 8,002
From: poway
A buddy of mine services, assembles and races these motors. He says a lot of guys say to replace the lifters, some push rods because both show ware early.. but he says over the years hes learned its really the rockers causing the issues. He defiantly uses the upper rpm band and would know. So Im completely going on his advise on that.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 12,878
Likes: 5,449
From: la la land jerzey
Thanks for the reply.. The ultima rockers are 1.675 versus 1.625.. I can see where there is slightly more load on the pushrods and lifters due to both the ratio and the weight. I suppose they could be lightened some.. I've run them in a few bikes and they were actually a little quieter than SnS.. I liked them because the I suspect that the main reason for them being 1.675 is that the roller side of the arm is about 0.030" longer and it seems to do a better job of centering the roller over the valve end when the valves are sunk some..
we also like the 2 degrees or duration and .025 lift you get ,550 lift cam from the ratio change
.302 lobe x 1.625 = .49075 - .302 lobes 1,675 = .50585
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Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 5,079
Likes: 2,151
From: Ohio
When Sachs was setting up my 127" he liked the stock cam that came in them with compression, it was strong for a street engine still having the ability to make Blue Ridge Parkway rides. Local Harley dealer was having free dyno pulls as a promotion for their new dyno machine, stopped in saying what the heck but it was a poorly run circus and got the bike out of there, no numbers with it high compressioned but In honesty I'm more happier with it pulled back for the street.
Ultima cases are thick and strong, heads are overkill but have finish qualities which can be expected in a mass production build, although Ultima offers a warranty with assembled engines being ok with the smaller engines for peace of mind, think the un-assembled package with the big cubes going through everything is the way to go,
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 5,079
Likes: 2,151
From: Ohio
Put a S&S 640 in with the 1.675 rockers, didn't calculate what the rocker ratio changed cam specs to, just interested in a softer hitting cam, those Ultima cams hit hard in city cruising or tree lined back roads having the ability to produce headaches. John J will be along shortly saying something about getting old but will forget what he is typing before done.
Last edited by 1997bagger; Oct 14, 2023 at 08:15 AM.
