BMW R18 vs HD Pan America
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Cruiser
Joined: Aug 2019
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From: Philippines
BMW R18 vs HD Pan America
It seems HD and BMW has come-up with models which clearly will stir the hornets nest in the respective markets they dominate, or should we say their competitor dominates. Which do you think will better succeed? The BMW R18 wreaking havoc in the cruiser market of HD or the Pan America gobbling up the adventure market of BMW?
Last edited by Rendezvous; Oct 27, 2020 at 07:26 AM.
Popular Reply
Oct 27, 2020, 05:38 AM
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 11,814
Likes: 5,120
From: SW Ohio
I just can't see either one of them doing very well.
BMW tried the cruiser thing a couple times before and it didn't work; despite the fact cruisers were the number one seller for ALL brands at the time. The changes to the motorcycle landscape from that time to this are not for the better. I wish them luck but you have to wonder about the rationale of trying something again that didn't work when sales were booming.
As to HD's entry into the "Adventure" bike market? In my opinion that's the deep end of the pool and Harley can't compete on a level playing field with other, more established models that are already out there. I'm betting the Pan America, when compared to other models, will be cobbled together, heavy, under powered, under sprung and worst of all more expensive. People who buy these bikes do so for what they "do", not what they "are". Harley just doesn't have any experience with that kind of engineering or manufacturing.
BMW tried the cruiser thing a couple times before and it didn't work; despite the fact cruisers were the number one seller for ALL brands at the time. The changes to the motorcycle landscape from that time to this are not for the better. I wish them luck but you have to wonder about the rationale of trying something again that didn't work when sales were booming.
As to HD's entry into the "Adventure" bike market? In my opinion that's the deep end of the pool and Harley can't compete on a level playing field with other, more established models that are already out there. I'm betting the Pan America, when compared to other models, will be cobbled together, heavy, under powered, under sprung and worst of all more expensive. People who buy these bikes do so for what they "do", not what they "are". Harley just doesn't have any experience with that kind of engineering or manufacturing.
Last edited by Campy Roadie; Oct 27, 2020 at 06:49 AM.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 11,814
Likes: 5,120
From: SW Ohio
I just can't see either one of them doing very well.
BMW tried the cruiser thing a couple times before and it didn't work; despite the fact cruisers were the number one seller for ALL brands at the time. The changes to the motorcycle landscape from that time to this are not for the better. I wish them luck but you have to wonder about the rationale of trying something again that didn't work when sales were booming.
As to HD's entry into the "Adventure" bike market? In my opinion that's the deep end of the pool and Harley can't compete on a level playing field with other, more established models that are already out there. I'm betting the Pan America, when compared to other models, will be cobbled together, heavy, under powered, under sprung and worst of all more expensive. People who buy these bikes do so for what they "do", not what they "are". Harley just doesn't have any experience with that kind of engineering or manufacturing.
BMW tried the cruiser thing a couple times before and it didn't work; despite the fact cruisers were the number one seller for ALL brands at the time. The changes to the motorcycle landscape from that time to this are not for the better. I wish them luck but you have to wonder about the rationale of trying something again that didn't work when sales were booming.
As to HD's entry into the "Adventure" bike market? In my opinion that's the deep end of the pool and Harley can't compete on a level playing field with other, more established models that are already out there. I'm betting the Pan America, when compared to other models, will be cobbled together, heavy, under powered, under sprung and worst of all more expensive. People who buy these bikes do so for what they "do", not what they "are". Harley just doesn't have any experience with that kind of engineering or manufacturing.
Last edited by Campy Roadie; Oct 27, 2020 at 06:49 AM.
Road Master
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 978
Likes: 423
From: UK
I agree. However, I met some mates at the BMW dealer last Friday (they do a good bacon sandwich). We were there less than an hour and the R18 went on two demo runs in that time. I parked my Slim next to one. The Slim is much prettier and less plastic, but if you don't want a Harley, the R18 might be the go to alternative. It looked like a serious piece of engineering. Their previous attempts were styling exercises on their current boxer model. This one is bespoke and looked more 'authentic'.
They've done their homework. They even put a hard as nails saddle on it, so you have to buy the comfort seat afterwards. Now that's authentic!
They've done their homework. They even put a hard as nails saddle on it, so you have to buy the comfort seat afterwards. Now that's authentic!
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 28,842
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From: Wisconsin, USA
I would be interested in the Pan American if the engine is reliable. Its reported to be 145hp, which would be more than adequate for me. And is comparable to BMW.
Looks like the luggage clasps are a lot more durable than my Ultras.
Looks like the luggage clasps are a lot more durable than my Ultras.
Grand HDF Member
Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 4,607
Likes: 3,311
From: Virginia
I tend to agree.
But it also depends upon which market you are looking at.
I think here in the USA there is more of a demand for an American made adventure bike than there is for a German made cruiser.
From what I have read the R18 is not a comfortable bike to ride, and with those big jugs sitting out there you can't stretch your legs out like you can on a Harley. So while it looks good sitting still it doesn't sound like a threat to Harley when it gets rolling.
On the other hand, unless the Pan America is a really good adventure bike at a very competitive price I don't see it hurting BMW adventure bike sales in Europe. The GS is king over there.
But it also depends upon which market you are looking at.
I think here in the USA there is more of a demand for an American made adventure bike than there is for a German made cruiser.
From what I have read the R18 is not a comfortable bike to ride, and with those big jugs sitting out there you can't stretch your legs out like you can on a Harley. So while it looks good sitting still it doesn't sound like a threat to Harley when it gets rolling.
On the other hand, unless the Pan America is a really good adventure bike at a very competitive price I don't see it hurting BMW adventure bike sales in Europe. The GS is king over there.
Club Member
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 6,905
Likes: 4,877
From: Midwest
On paper, it looks like the specs will be competitive to opposing bikes in each class. But It's impossible to draw conclusions about the bike until people start riding it. It will boil down to which bike does someone enjoy riding more and what the personal cost to benefit ratio is.
The PA is geared towards the North American market. It has no chance against BMW in Europe and I don't think HD even is thinking of how it will compete in Europe.
The PA is geared towards the North American market. It has no chance against BMW in Europe and I don't think HD even is thinking of how it will compete in Europe.
Last edited by MiniWolf; Oct 27, 2020 at 07:53 AM.
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Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: May 2008
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From: 'Noke, VA
The PA, assuming it's reliable, has already hit its mark. 145hp, under 500 pounds, P&A support, and a $20k starting price. If there's any way I can swing it, I'll get one. If it doesn't falter out of the gate, it'll do fine elsewhere. BMW will remain King of the Adventure Hill, and that's fine.
The R18 is a niche bike. It looks a thousand times better than the R1200C, and in that sandbox, looks are king. There are plenty of people who want a luxury cruiser and wouldn't be caught dead on a Harley.
The R18 is a niche bike. It looks a thousand times better than the R1200C, and in that sandbox, looks are king. There are plenty of people who want a luxury cruiser and wouldn't be caught dead on a Harley.
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Intermediate
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 34
Likes: 23
From: Wilmington
I'd rather have a RNineT than a R18 because the RNineT just looks like a cool BMW rather than a BMW in a Harley costume.
But I also admit I think the PanAmerica is pretty hideous and I'd get a KTM if I wanted something like that, but that's just me.
But I also admit I think the PanAmerica is pretty hideous and I'd get a KTM if I wanted something like that, but that's just me.
