Good GOD, doesn't Harley Davidson monitor their service department reps, or do they just make a piece of SH*^ bike? Here is the crap...........

'07 RK Classic......I have NO experience with motorcycle mechanics, so I am no shy person when it comes to asking the " expert " on what I should do. (expert = Service department tech ONLY from the HD shop I bought my ride from)

I wanted just extra pop to the exhaust.........I go to the "expert" they suggest slip-ons.

I was comuting nearly 200 miles a day and wanted the best for MPG......... I go to the "expert" they suggest also adding the free breath Stage I air cleaner for efficiency.

I got Reinhardt slipons from my beautiful wife(that actually talked me into the Harley Davidson) for X-mas '07, and I had a 100 dollar gift cert, from referring a friend to the "experts", so I got the Stage I air cleaner in Feb-'08.

Well the "expert" suggested with these additions, I should re-map the beast to keep her running good. Re-mapped the bike Feb '08

I now own a beautiful piece of SH*%.............mileage went from 45mpg to about 35mpg.

more woes.............. I am in the military. I drove the new mapped beauty for about 3 trips due to weather, and did not notice the seat of pants WOW of power, but I LOVE the sound! But I have since transfered to my new duty station.....far far away from all the "experts" that did the work.

I went to the new local "expert" to get the opinion on the crap. (the new local gas is 91 octane, I now have pre-det also to spin me off into a dimention of total Pissed Off-nessed)

New "expert" fired off with a probable need for a Race Tuner and dyno time to get it tuned..............($985.000) WTF!

Are HD bikes so sensitive to MINIOR changes that I need damn near a grand worth of work on top of the $600 bucks of parts that I bought? Are the "experts" only making a sale to get their techs their hourly wage? WTF (again)

I have gone across this country to two different "experts" and have gotten TOTAL different "needs"........... WTF (for the last time)[>:]

 

To answer the one question in there, yes, they're that sensitive. Welcome to EFI - tune it to match the mods and the milage and power will be there.

edit: Think about it. you're adding more air, more fuel, different flows... you have to change it to make it work right. It doesn't match the new inputs on its own. 985 is about right - the tune itself is $500 or so, and it'll take 4-6 hours of dyno time to get it dialed in. This is what happens when you modify a vehicle - trust me, the second guy is probably right (and this will fix the pre-det too).

 

1) Any bike can do the exact same thing once you start changing pipes, etc....it isn't just HD

2) All you needed to do was just the slip ons - no reflash, no stage 1, etc

3) You open everything up, different than HD set it upand you will burn more gas...not less

 

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There was the pissed part.......... I thought for sure from my automotive history.......changing something as small as a muffler (I used to LOVE cherry bombs) NEVER required ANYTHING!

The "expert" said I was changing things too much for the HD to take..........re-map!

 

Well if you get and increase in HP or torque then you're gonna see a change in fuel mileage. Personally I've never gotten good mileage out of my glide so I've pretty much come to accept the 36 mpg I'm getting. A fuel management system would probably go a long way towards curing some of your ills. You've got the Rhinehart slip-ons with the Stage I so you could add the Powercommander PCIII, you can install this yourself without any problems and then add a downloaded map or go through Fuel Moto USA for your Powercommander and tell them what you're wanting as far as optimum mpg's and they'll hook you up. Haven't used them myself but most people on here recommend them.

 

Rinehart 2+2 Flush cut, Stage 1 (K&N), and a PCIII (installed myself with map directly from dynojet)...gained around 10+ HP and Torque, runs cooler, uses more gas. I don't own a Harley to "save on gas", and if I was worried about saving a couple bucks on mileage, I wouldn't have bought a 20k bike to justify 10mpg compared to my cage. Enjoy your "beautiful piece of $hit".

 

Now let me also preface that I do know something about the internal combustion engine. Again, engines do lean up if you increase the airflow in and out. ? is, was where the line is drawn and you have gone beyone the ability of the stock engine MAP to handle and adapt.

There is where the "expert" problem comes in. There is where you get "opinion". Maybe I am coming down too hard on the service techs...........I know there are damn near unlimited numbers of different combos that people do their bikes.........but when you go to a expert for a combo............the expert should be able to make a combe that works and not DEGRADE the bike.

 

Stage 1 should not have taken you from 45 to 35 mpg.

I have 4000 miles on myUltra ... before stage 1I got about 35/36 mpg commuting , I get about 35/36 mpgafter stage1 (no slip-ons) commuting. Got about the same with my '06 Deluxe with stage 1 and true duals.

 

You will have to have it retuned Im afraid. Nothing wrong with that, money involved, yeah. I know how you feel.

A good tuner will know when and where to adjust the fuel map during acceleration. Your ECM knows when its just cruising and when your ripping open the throttle. The power enrichment tables should be adjustable seprately from the base tables. Thats my understanding from screwing around with my SERT.

BTW, I bought my own SERT. Installed the software on my PC, found the approriate MAP given my engine displacement, intake and exhaust. I remapped my ECM with that precanned map. On a recent road trip I averaged between 40-50MPG depending on the head wind. Not bad for an SE Stage One Intake and Vance and Hines Big Shots. Yes, I still have my ***** to the wall performance.

NOTE: My in City MPG varies depending on my mood and how much open road I have in front of me. I will have my girl tuned for gas mileage by a professional eventually. I could care less who I can smoke in a race; as long as I sound awesome losing, Im happy!!!