The cost of doing 'just' cams
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Road Master
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 963
Likes: 1
From: Bellefonte PA
The cost of doing 'just' cams
Not even sure why I'm thinking about it, but I can't not think about a cam upgrade. 2004 Road King, stage 1 air, pipes, PC. Thinking about a "bolt-in" cam like an Andrews 21 or something for some more grunt. Don't have any plans of any major engine builds, just thinking. Anyway, have read a lot about how a cam swap is easy to do with basic wrench skills. If I did it, I would most likely upgrade my tensioners, or go to gear driVe. How much more complicated does this make the process as a DIY project? All this talk about crank runout etc. makes me a little leary. When including these changes, what sort of a price tag should I budget for for something like this, assuming that is that I can muster up the nerve to do it myself. For comparison purposes what would I pay in labor for an indy to do it? Thanks
Road Warrior
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,268
Likes: 2
I'm not sure how expensive the old tensioners are to replace, seems like I've heard 40 to 60 each. If you're worried about the runout of the crank you can put the new plate and pump in there with the pressure fed tensioners and chain drive. that'll cost about 500, that's what I did and I'd do it again, but, it does ad quite a bit to the cost of a simple cam change. Herko has the complete kit to do this with and he's a danged nice fellow to deal with. He can sell you the cams, and I'd bet he'll recommend the 21's the chain drive , somewhere in the neighborhood of 800 plus pushrods about 160. if you'll pm me I'll give you his phone number. when you buy his kit it comes with everything that you could possibly need including new screws. you can do this job on a saturday yourself if you have even a little mechanical skill. lotsa videos on utube for instructions too. it's really not a difficult job.
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 2,932
Likes: 32
From: Broomfield, CO
I did several S&S 510 gear drive swap outs for my GF and friend. The only special tool that I needed was the cam chest bearing remover/installer that I got from George's Garage. I used a dial caliper gauge to check the run-out. The gear drive cams were about $600 and my time. An Indy would probably charge you anywhere from $400 to $600 for labor.
Elite HDF Member
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 4,020
Likes: 69
From: Twin Cities, MN
You said "Not even sure why I'm thinking about it, but I can't not think about a cam upgrade."
Well I will tell you why. I had the 21's put in this spring and absolutely love the upgrade. Fantastic cam for every day RK riding. Pulls like a freight train in all 5 gears. It's not a "racing" cam but it doesn't hurt the high end either. I am more than happy with this cam.
Regarding your question about doing it yourself, I can't help you there. I had my indy put in the cam and the HD SE hydraulic tensioner kit. After all parts (also new lifters) and labor it cost me $1,500. Now I don't have much cash so this was a big deal to me, but it was worth every penny!
Great riding cam and piece of mind with the new tensioner set up. My indy has opened up hundreds of newer bikes to put in cams and said not only was there not ever a failure with the HD set up, but mosts showed almost no wear. I'm happy with both componants.
Well I will tell you why. I had the 21's put in this spring and absolutely love the upgrade. Fantastic cam for every day RK riding. Pulls like a freight train in all 5 gears. It's not a "racing" cam but it doesn't hurt the high end either. I am more than happy with this cam.
Regarding your question about doing it yourself, I can't help you there. I had my indy put in the cam and the HD SE hydraulic tensioner kit. After all parts (also new lifters) and labor it cost me $1,500. Now I don't have much cash so this was a big deal to me, but it was worth every penny!
Great riding cam and piece of mind with the new tensioner set up. My indy has opened up hundreds of newer bikes to put in cams and said not only was there not ever a failure with the HD set up, but mosts showed almost no wear. I'm happy with both componants.
If you are thinking about a big bore kit, but money is tight right now, consider that you will be doing it in the future and plan your cam change (now) with the results you want now and later, not sure what the Andrews 21 would do with the big bore kit. But my thought on this is to plan and not have to change the cams again later.
Tourer
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 449
Likes: 0
From: Auburn, Georgia
I just let Fuel Moto do my cam upgrade. All I did was the cams and pushrods. Cost $325 in labor for everything. Could I have done the work yes but I would have to purchase some tools. Easier to just let Jamie do it for me. Also gave me an excuse to ride the bike up to his place!
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Road Warrior
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,733
Likes: 38
From: Linden, NC
The Andrews 21's, in a 88" motor, will give you a nice, seat of the pants improvement over your stock cams. Plenty of grunt from 1800-4500 rpm's. They can be used with a big bore kit, but you have to watch compression. 9.5:1 is the most you want, and you can always throw in some 1.725" ratio rocker arms to increase lift to .530". There are alot of people (including myself) happily running this type of mouse cam set-up with zero problems.
As far as upgrading the cam chest, I went with gears. Runout was within tolerances, and haven't had any trouble with them. They are a bit trickier to set up. The hydraulic tensioner conversion kits seem to be holding up real well and are much more forgiving than gears, not to mention easier for the DIY to install. Best conversion kit on the market is the one John Wadsworth, aka Herko, at Flying W Performance sells, http://www.flyingwperformance.com/. But both the MoCo and Andrews sells conversion kit also.
Labor costs will probably run anywhere from $600-$800 for someone else to do the work, as long as you supply everything associated (cams, bearings, adjustable pushrods, gaskets, and a fuel management system).
If you don't have any immediate plans on doing a big bore upgrade, then the 21's will work fine and perform well. But from experience, if you're going to do a big bore in the sort term, then wait to do the cams. Once you go to 95", it opens up many more options for cams you can use.
Good luck either way you go.
As far as upgrading the cam chest, I went with gears. Runout was within tolerances, and haven't had any trouble with them. They are a bit trickier to set up. The hydraulic tensioner conversion kits seem to be holding up real well and are much more forgiving than gears, not to mention easier for the DIY to install. Best conversion kit on the market is the one John Wadsworth, aka Herko, at Flying W Performance sells, http://www.flyingwperformance.com/. But both the MoCo and Andrews sells conversion kit also.
Labor costs will probably run anywhere from $600-$800 for someone else to do the work, as long as you supply everything associated (cams, bearings, adjustable pushrods, gaskets, and a fuel management system).
If you don't have any immediate plans on doing a big bore upgrade, then the 21's will work fine and perform well. But from experience, if you're going to do a big bore in the sort term, then wait to do the cams. Once you go to 95", it opens up many more options for cams you can use.
Good luck either way you go.
Last edited by Weevil; Aug 3, 2011 at 07:16 AM.
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Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 2,263
Likes: 36
From: Georgia Mountains
My 88" with gear driven Andrew's 21's, A/C, stage 1 download, V&H Dresser Dual headers and Supertrapp mufflers easily pulls away from stock 96" touring bikes. The gear driven cams provided the most obvious gain in performance. No change in MPG. I DO NOT have any fuel controller installed
Grand HDF Member
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 3,835
Likes: 498
From: Northern WV
A couple years ago I sold my FXDXI with 18K. Last year the new owner had the dealer check the cam tensioners, which were found to be wearing down. So since they were running a 15% off parts and labor (late Fall) he had them upgrade with the complete hydraulic tensioner system. They called him and suggested he consider a new cam since they were already in there so he agreed.
I just bought the bike back from him last week and it does run (and sound) noticibly better than stock. As far as what cam I'm not sure? Probably what ever dealers sell from their Screamin Eagle parts book. (He said he's going to find the bill for me) The cost to have them do all this was over $1,600 including the discount.
I just bought the bike back from him last week and it does run (and sound) noticibly better than stock. As far as what cam I'm not sure? Probably what ever dealers sell from their Screamin Eagle parts book. (He said he's going to find the bill for me) The cost to have them do all this was over $1,600 including the discount.
Last edited by Ridewva; Aug 3, 2011 at 09:03 AM.