WTF with the starter now?
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Road Warrior
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,252
Likes: 142
WTF with the starter now?
Ok, this is getting dumb. 1974 FLH, 8.5:1, S&S Super E, Bored .030. Top end completely rebuilt, Heads, pistons, rings, etc etc. I just put a new h12 battery in, new cables, new solenoid, new relay and today a New All ***** 1.4kw high torgue starter. Reset the valves cold as well. Hit the button spun like a bitch and started like no tomorrow. I let it warm up. Tried it again and it moans and groans like the battery is almost dead then takes off. Timing is good because it does it with the kill switch off as well. The starter button signal is 13 v at the relay as well. What is going on here. Im pissed.
randy
randy
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Road Warrior
Joined: Sep 2007
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It didn't do this when it was first built. I have put about 800 miles on it. I will try it cold tomorrow and see if it starts the same as it did the second I keyed the new starter then try it hot again. Something just aint right.
Randy
Randy
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Road Warrior
Joined: Sep 2007
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Yes it has a kicker and no its not hot to the touch. It will groan and not roll over. sounds like a dying cow then it will spin. The grounds are good and i was going to make another and put it on, although there is nothing on the new starter to ground to.
There is however one remote thing that could cause it. I doubled up on the starter shaft washer in the outer primary. The shaft would come too far out and get hung up in the clutch ring gear. I put two on the end and that has never happened since. I might loosen off the outer primary cover about a 16th inch or so and just try that to see. Its a long shot but everything else is brand new with the exception of the starter button.
randy
There is however one remote thing that could cause it. I doubled up on the starter shaft washer in the outer primary. The shaft would come too far out and get hung up in the clutch ring gear. I put two on the end and that has never happened since. I might loosen off the outer primary cover about a 16th inch or so and just try that to see. Its a long shot but everything else is brand new with the exception of the starter button.
randy
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 8,608
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From: Cental, MI
Yep.
If the voltage is holding as you indicate, then it must be going into a bind. I have never needed more than one thrust washer on that shaft, Certainly a cause for concern. As not only will it go into a bind, but, the shaft travel is directly related to the washer engagement inside the solenoid!
edit; Obout the Kicker
Does it kick over easily enough even when it won't roll with E start??
If the voltage is holding as you indicate, then it must be going into a bind. I have never needed more than one thrust washer on that shaft, Certainly a cause for concern. As not only will it go into a bind, but, the shaft travel is directly related to the washer engagement inside the solenoid!
edit; Obout the Kicker
Does it kick over easily enough even when it won't roll with E start??
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 15,705
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From: Farmington ,MS
The washer only controls how far the bendix comes out...it will not bind it up...once the bendix bottoms out on the washer. the solenoid will continue to pull in because of the spring that pulls the shifter lever ...I have had to run 2 washers many times with aftermarket primary's to keep it from hanging up in the starter gear. Check it with the kicker, hot and cold to see if the motor actually gets harder to turn over. If not go back to the basics...have you load tested the battery? Just because it is new does not mean it is not defective.
Last edited by Tom84FXST; Oct 18, 2014 at 09:04 AM.
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Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 8,608
Likes: 3,375
From: Cental, MI
Yea...the starter could be bad...When it acts -up jumper it, bypassing the Bendix. this should turn just the starter motor..aggressively.
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Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Nov 2009
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From: Farmington ,MS
Since the starter works sometimes, and stalls others...without getting hot... you can almost bet you have a bad connection somewhere...have you actually put a wrench on every connection since this started? Check the voltage with a meter on the lower solenoid terminal that goes to the starter..while cranking...if it drops lower that 10 volts...it is not going to work very well.
Last edited by Tom84FXST; Oct 18, 2014 at 10:05 AM.
Seasoned HDF Member
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From: South Carolina
Do some voltage drop tests.
For the info to be valid, each test must be performed while the starter is cranking sluggish.
When using the voltmeter, touch the probes to the battery post and solenoid post-not the cable or its terminal.
Touch the voltmeter probes to the battery posts, press the starter button and read the system cranking voltage. It should be at least 9.5 volts (this is the voltage you will compare other checks to, system cranking voltage).
Touch one probe to the solenoid post (the post that the battery cable goes to), the other to the starter body, crank engine, you should read system cranking voltage.
If you read system cranking voltage, it means the electrical circuit is good,the problem is a bad motor, or a mechanical problem causing excess drag on the starter.
If system cranking voltage is low:
Touch probes to both solenoid posts, crank engine, you should read zero voltage (this means the contacts are good). If you read more than a half volt here, it means the contacts have excessive resistance.
If solenoid is ok:
Touch one probe to the solenoid post, the other probe to the negative battery post, crank engine.
If system cranking voltage is normal, it means the problem is somewhere in the ground circuit (between the body of the starter and the negative battery post).
If the voltage is still low, the problem is between the positive battery post and the solenoid post (either the battery cable itself or the connections).
For the info to be valid, each test must be performed while the starter is cranking sluggish.
When using the voltmeter, touch the probes to the battery post and solenoid post-not the cable or its terminal.
Touch the voltmeter probes to the battery posts, press the starter button and read the system cranking voltage. It should be at least 9.5 volts (this is the voltage you will compare other checks to, system cranking voltage).
Touch one probe to the solenoid post (the post that the battery cable goes to), the other to the starter body, crank engine, you should read system cranking voltage.
If you read system cranking voltage, it means the electrical circuit is good,the problem is a bad motor, or a mechanical problem causing excess drag on the starter.
If system cranking voltage is low:
Touch probes to both solenoid posts, crank engine, you should read zero voltage (this means the contacts are good). If you read more than a half volt here, it means the contacts have excessive resistance.
If solenoid is ok:
Touch one probe to the solenoid post, the other probe to the negative battery post, crank engine.
If system cranking voltage is normal, it means the problem is somewhere in the ground circuit (between the body of the starter and the negative battery post).
If the voltage is still low, the problem is between the positive battery post and the solenoid post (either the battery cable itself or the connections).