Power Commander III...Yes or No?
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Stage IV
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
From: Virginia, Southeast
Power Commander III...Yes or No?
Hello to all! This is my first post here! Looking forward to corresponding with all of my Softtail brothers and sisters!
OK...here's my question: I'm a first time Harley owner. Bought a 2008 Fatboy FLSTF. It is/was completely stock. I just added Python slip-ons for some deeper sound, and it sounds great!
I also just bought a Harley Stage 1 air flow system and a Power Commander III.
The bike currently runs great and sounds great. But I would like a little more power/performance. I've been told that if I add the hi-performance Stage 1 filter then I'll need to do something like the power commander to regulate the fuel. I've already purchased the Stage 1 and the Power Commander, (Can always return them) but my Harley mechanic friend tells me to enjoy the the bike the way it is and don't mess with it anymore.
My mechanic friend is not a Power Commander fan...says it's sole purpose is to "trick" the stock Harley computer and then what you have is two computers contantly battling each other.
So here's my questions...do I absolutely need to install the Power Commander if I intall the Stage 1? Do I just leave things as they are...enjoy the sound of the slip-ons and return the PC and Stage 1?
Hoping to solicit some advice from you guys/gals with similar experience.
Also...does the 2008 Fatboy have O2 Sensors? I don't have my bike close by so I can't look to see.
OK...here's my question: I'm a first time Harley owner. Bought a 2008 Fatboy FLSTF. It is/was completely stock. I just added Python slip-ons for some deeper sound, and it sounds great!
I also just bought a Harley Stage 1 air flow system and a Power Commander III.
The bike currently runs great and sounds great. But I would like a little more power/performance. I've been told that if I add the hi-performance Stage 1 filter then I'll need to do something like the power commander to regulate the fuel. I've already purchased the Stage 1 and the Power Commander, (Can always return them) but my Harley mechanic friend tells me to enjoy the the bike the way it is and don't mess with it anymore.
My mechanic friend is not a Power Commander fan...says it's sole purpose is to "trick" the stock Harley computer and then what you have is two computers contantly battling each other.
So here's my questions...do I absolutely need to install the Power Commander if I intall the Stage 1? Do I just leave things as they are...enjoy the sound of the slip-ons and return the PC and Stage 1?
Hoping to solicit some advice from you guys/gals with similar experience.
Also...does the 2008 Fatboy have O2 Sensors? I don't have my bike close by so I can't look to see.
I did stage 1 on my train the day I bought it in 2005, I never saw it or rode it in stock form. I went with the PCIII. No issues at all and have put 45k miles on it. Harley's are lean from the factory, and only get leaner with mods. A fuel management system is probably not required, but certainly is nice to be able to tune your bike to run at its optimum performance. You'll probably get MANY different opinions on this in here. I say install your PCIII, get a good dyno tune, and don't think about it again. If you do more mods down the road, it'll be super easy to retune for the new setup.
Tourer
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 302
Likes: 4
From: Edmonton, AB, Canada
Or you can have someone tune the OEM ECM. Either way works.
I'd say it's a matter of what experts you have locally. You need someone who knows what they are doing to get the most out of a tuning investment of any kind.
I'd say it's a matter of what experts you have locally. You need someone who knows what they are doing to get the most out of a tuning investment of any kind.
Thread Starter
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Stage IV
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
From: Virginia, Southeast
Jreichart-
I think you mentioned you never rode your bike stock...I was wondering if you might be able to tell me if you realized any difference in your bikes performance (stock vs. Stage 1 and PWRCOMM III). But if ypou never rode your bike stock...then I guess you'd have no frame of reference.
Much appreciate the advice tho!
I think you mentioned you never rode your bike stock...I was wondering if you might be able to tell me if you realized any difference in your bikes performance (stock vs. Stage 1 and PWRCOMM III). But if ypou never rode your bike stock...then I guess you'd have no frame of reference.
Much appreciate the advice tho!
Road Captain
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 507
Likes: 4
From: Wentzville, Missouri
The stock ECM cal is on the lean side. Your motor will run hot (albeit that's normal) right out of the box. If you put more air in your air fuel mixture (high flow filter), it will run leaner and hotter. It may still run just fine although certainly not optimum and lots of forum folks will say that additional fuel management is not required. However...if you install the stage one filter, installing the power commander and a dyno session will optimize engine performance and your bike "should" run better and cooler than not.
Mike
Mike
Road Warrior
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,523
Likes: 312
From: Out of Commiefornia!
Do the AC and install the PC III, and find someone local who knows how to tune with the PC to do a good tune.
Your bike will run better, stay cooler, and you'll enjoy riding while you wait for the 'mod bug' to hit... the PC III can accommodate the changes once the bug bites.
Else return the PC III and go with whatever tuning device your tuner of choice prefers. Definitely want a tuning device of some sort, so you can get it running well and get off the stock lean tune.
Roger
Your bike will run better, stay cooler, and you'll enjoy riding while you wait for the 'mod bug' to hit... the PC III can accommodate the changes once the bug bites.
Else return the PC III and go with whatever tuning device your tuner of choice prefers. Definitely want a tuning device of some sort, so you can get it running well and get off the stock lean tune.
Roger
Advanced
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 93
Likes: 0
From: York, PA
+1 what Roger said
go to at the very least get a map from PC.
Getting it run on a dyno tells it all if the guy knows what he is doing.
I would not just run it without really knowing where the fuel values are set.
Craig
go to at the very least get a map from PC.
Getting it run on a dyno tells it all if the guy knows what he is doing.
I would not just run it without really knowing where the fuel values are set.
Craig
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Road Master
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 960
Likes: 1
From: United States
I did stage 1 on my train the day I bought it in 2005, I never saw it or rode it in stock form. I went with the PCIII. No issues at all and have put 45k miles on it. Harley's are lean from the factory, and only get leaner with mods. A fuel management system is probably not required, but certainly is nice to be able to tune your bike to run at its optimum performance. You'll probably get MANY different opinions on this in here. I say install your PCIII, get a good dyno tune, and don't think about it again. If you do more mods down the road, it'll be super easy to retune for the new setup.
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Get it dyno tuned with the tuner you got. You will get the best possible power out of it because every engine is different,and canned maps are pretty generic.
You will get better fuel economy and more power with a dyno tune. And now you will have a reference point if anything goes on with the bike.
With today's fuel injection system and the precision of it that makes custom tuning even more important.
You will get better fuel economy and more power with a dyno tune. And now you will have a reference point if anything goes on with the bike.
With today's fuel injection system and the precision of it that makes custom tuning even more important.
Stellar HDF Member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,395
Likes: 153
From: Utah
The '07's had O2 sensors. I don't know if the HD ECM ran them in closed loop. or not, however. That might have been '08 before they did that. Anyway, the PCIII and the stock ECM don't "fight" each other. The PCIII intercepts the ECM's signals and refactors them so that the ECM thinks everything is fine and the PCIII is controlling the AFR unbeknownst to the ECM. However, since you already have O2 sensors, I would recommend that you choose one of the autotune ECM replacements, whether its a PC or TMax or whatever. You will get better performance (still not up to a dyno, however) and more flexibility for future mods that you're swearing you won't do... but you will.
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