Why New Lifters w/ Cam Change?????
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Road Captain
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 594
Likes: 4
From: Texas
Why New Lifters w/ Cam Change?????
I'm swapping out the stock cam in my '06 DLX for an Andrews 26 & doing the "chain tensioner" upgrade to hydraulics at the same time.
Many of the threads I've read say to change out the Tappets/Lifters at the same time. I don't see why and was hoping Forum members would share their views.
My bike has just over 10,000 miles on the stock "B" lifters. The Cam is "mild" and not "wild". Yes I know that eventually lifters have to be replaced (30,000+ miles unless there is an issue) but with the new adjustable Push-rods that will go in as part of the Cam change, dropping new lifters in later is not a biggie.
Why do folks recommend replacement (usually with aftermarket Tappets from Jims, S&S, Crane, etc. etc.)??????
Thanks, D
Many of the threads I've read say to change out the Tappets/Lifters at the same time. I don't see why and was hoping Forum members would share their views.
My bike has just over 10,000 miles on the stock "B" lifters. The Cam is "mild" and not "wild". Yes I know that eventually lifters have to be replaced (30,000+ miles unless there is an issue) but with the new adjustable Push-rods that will go in as part of the Cam change, dropping new lifters in later is not a biggie.
Why do folks recommend replacement (usually with aftermarket Tappets from Jims, S&S, Crane, etc. etc.)??????
Thanks, D
Elite HDF Member
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 4,501
Likes: 26
From: Sheboygan,Wi
Generally speaking when you install a new cam it's surface is harder then your old cam with 10,000 miles on it. Your old lifters will be softer and can wear down quickly. It is always best to change both. Just good insurance.
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Road Captain
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 594
Likes: 4
From: Texas
Well as to the "Why not" - simple an additional expense that can be delayed. Since the lifters go in from the top and , assuming you use adjustable PR's and don't take the heads off, the labor to do it later is just the removal , reinstall and re-adjustment of the Push Rods. That's not much.....
Now as to Misbehaven's comments - I'm not a materials engineer so cannot debate the relative hardness changes between a 10,000 mile cam and a new cam. The "conclusion" I would draw from the comment is that the "new" cam and the "new" lifters would have to be made from "better (aka harder)" materials than the stock but IF you replace the stock lifters with another set of stock lifters (and don't go aftermarket) would the result be the same???
I would think that the stock cam and stock tappet/lifters would actually "work harden" in the 10,000 miles you've run.
Not trying to be argumentative but understand the logic. Every Auto mechanic I've talked with says they do not replace tappets when they put a new cam in.........
as "Wall-E" says , More Input please.......
Thanks, D
Now as to Misbehaven's comments - I'm not a materials engineer so cannot debate the relative hardness changes between a 10,000 mile cam and a new cam. The "conclusion" I would draw from the comment is that the "new" cam and the "new" lifters would have to be made from "better (aka harder)" materials than the stock but IF you replace the stock lifters with another set of stock lifters (and don't go aftermarket) would the result be the same???
I would think that the stock cam and stock tappet/lifters would actually "work harden" in the 10,000 miles you've run.
Not trying to be argumentative but understand the logic. Every Auto mechanic I've talked with says they do not replace tappets when they put a new cam in.........
as "Wall-E" says , More Input please.......
Thanks, D
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 66,948
Likes: 4,573
From: TOAK western branch
The new lifters have been outsourced to Mexico and have been problematic. Aftermarket lifters are much better and unless you plan on opening the cam chest again if you replace all wearable items at the same time you shouldn't have to open it again.
Stellar HDF Member
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 2,404
Likes: 11
From: Southern Nevada (Pahrump)
I'm certainly no expert but I know many that have done cam upgrades without replacing the lifters with no ill effect. If you've got the cash burnin a hole in your pocket go for it. Otherwise I think you will be fine. JMHO
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 66,948
Likes: 4,573
From: TOAK western branch
I agree. As for me I had 90k on the bike when I did the cams so I woulda been stupid not to change them. They are pricy though. If someone were to have more than 40k on their bike I would say change them.
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im glad i came across this post. I've decided to keep my bike and have watching videos and reading about changing the cams. Just a little bit colder and she is going under the knife.
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Thread Starter
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Road Captain
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 594
Likes: 4
From: Texas
Soft 02 - I hear you on all points. I think the "new" stock lifters are all "C"'s and I have heard of issues (hit and miss) with those. I already have a set of "B" lifters on the shelf (although they are not brand new either - about 10,000 on them as well) so having to replace my current "B"s with the problematic "C"s is not a problem.
The real issue is spending the bucks (they can get pricey!!!) now on aftermarket (pick one vendor) and then not being happy with the noise/result..........
What I'm thinking is to just use the current lifters i have and then see what the results are. If I do not like the result then I can always replace them with my "spare" set of "B"s OR buy aftermarket. I don't have to open up the Cam Chest to replace just the Tappets.
In my mind, I'm trying to justify why NOT to buy the replacement aftermarket now versus only potentially later. I agree it's good insurance but no need to throw good money at a problem that does not exist...... If there is a valid mechanical reason to replace now, then I'll do it.
In for a penny then in for a Pound!!!!
The real issue is spending the bucks (they can get pricey!!!) now on aftermarket (pick one vendor) and then not being happy with the noise/result..........
What I'm thinking is to just use the current lifters i have and then see what the results are. If I do not like the result then I can always replace them with my "spare" set of "B"s OR buy aftermarket. I don't have to open up the Cam Chest to replace just the Tappets.
In my mind, I'm trying to justify why NOT to buy the replacement aftermarket now versus only potentially later. I agree it's good insurance but no need to throw good money at a problem that does not exist...... If there is a valid mechanical reason to replace now, then I'll do it.
In for a penny then in for a Pound!!!!
Elite HDF Member
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 4,501
Likes: 26
From: Sheboygan,Wi
I am sure some parts are better made now then years past. And yes 10,000 miles is not that much. I guess I was referring to days gone bye when I have seen new lifters flatten out an old cam, and vise versa. I have always changed out lifters, Cam's and push rod's when doing a cam or lifter change.