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Air Cleaner Question

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Old Oct 12, 2012 | 07:44 AM
  #1  
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Default Air Cleaner Question

My bike has a screaming eagle stage 1 kit installed on it, was there when I bought it. I want to put in a forced air cleaner in its place am I going to need to take it in to have the tuner adjusted?

Thanks.
 
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Old Oct 12, 2012 | 08:41 AM
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Do you have aftermarket pipes? If so, then yes. Just an intake doesn't matter much because it's not helping the exhaust get out any faster.
 
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Old Oct 12, 2012 | 09:58 AM
  #3  
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Any time U make a change to ur motor it can make a difference..

We are not mind readers nor do we have computer vision to see Ur bike.

It will be that way on all Ur questions. U need to put some more information on what U have so we can help U better.

It'd be nice to at least know what yr ur bike is, what motor, FI or carbed, any other work done to Ur motor, like Cams, pipes, and what tuner if U have one.

The amount of air in is directly related to how much air can go out.

If U have stock pipes and heads then Ur motor can only flow so much air depending on Ur pipes and heads.

Ur SE A/C has more than enough air flow capacity for most all but the really big builds.
So by putting a A/C that allows more air flow is just a waste of Money if its nots matched, meaning an A/C can be too big to what Ur motor can process, thereby adding a bigger one will not help any.

Even with open pipes and the biggest A/C out there, Ur heads will then determine how much air flows through Ur motor which is usually less than
most High Perf, A/C.

Here are some numbers I've been able to find -

HD stock - 171CFM
Stage 1 Big Sucker - 200CFM
Stage 2 Big Sucker - 250CFM
Kuryakyn Twin Velocity - 270CFM
E-3014 = 248 CFM RK-3009 kit
E-3037 = 301 CFM RK-3910 kit
HD-0800 = 231 CFM SE replacement
Doherty Powerpacc - 287CFM
SE Air Cleaner - 287 CFM
Zippers - 321 CFM
Woods Carbs - 4 models 235CFM upto 340CFM
BC Overflow - 800+CFM


Here's the CFM's needed for most street build, found this one in another forum.

CFM= cubic inches x RPM x volumetric efficiency (divided by) 3456

CI = 95 (or whatever motor size you have)
RPM = 6200 (or redline for your motor)
VE = 1 Volumetric Efficiency is normally around 85-90% for a street build, but for sake of easy calculating and over estimating, we can go with 100%.

CFM = 95 X 6200 X 1 / 3456 = 170 cfm

That is the basic formula to figure out CFM needed for any build.

So at most on a 95'' built motor,, it only needs a filter that has 170 CFM, but U need a little more for when it get dirty, say250CFM to be safe.


Lets take a 88''er X 5800 X .85 /3456 = 125CFM --What a stock 88''er has.

For a Stg1 88'er U only need 125 CFM for Ur motor, That why the stock air filter is around 170 CFM, Even dirty it will still handle the motors needs..

So the, SE A/C has 287 CFM and will be over 100% more than enough Air flow.





.
 

Last edited by oct1949; Oct 12, 2012 at 10:01 AM.
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Old Oct 12, 2012 | 10:09 AM
  #4  
Kenney's Avatar
Kenney
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Joined: Feb 2006
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Default

Originally Posted by oct1949
Any time U make a change to ur motor it can make a difference..

We are not mind readers nor do we have computer vision to see Ur bike.

It will be that way on all Ur questions. U need to put some more information on what U have so we can help U better.

It'd be nice to at least know what yr ur bike is, what motor, FI or carbed, any other work done to Ur motor, like Cams, pipes, and what tuner if U have one.

The amount of air in is directly related to how much air can go out.

If U have stock pipes and heads then Ur motor can only flow so much air depending on Ur pipes and heads.

Ur SE A/C has more than enough air flow capacity for most all but the really big builds.
So by putting a A/C that allows more air flow is just a waste of Money if its nots matched, meaning an A/C can be too big to what Ur motor can process, thereby adding a bigger one will not help any.

Even with open pipes and the biggest A/C out there, Ur heads will then determine how much air flows through Ur motor which is usually less than
most High Perf, A/C.

Here are some numbers I've been able to find -

HD stock - 171CFM
Stage 1 Big Sucker - 200CFM
Stage 2 Big Sucker - 250CFM
Kuryakyn Twin Velocity - 270CFM
E-3014 = 248 CFM RK-3009 kit
E-3037 = 301 CFM RK-3910 kit
HD-0800 = 231 CFM SE replacement
Doherty Powerpacc - 287CFM
SE Air Cleaner - 287 CFM
Zippers - 321 CFM
Woods Carbs - 4 models 235CFM upto 340CFM
BC Overflow - 800+CFM


Here's the CFM's needed for most street build, found this one in another forum.

CFM= cubic inches x RPM x volumetric efficiency (divided by) 3456

CI = 95 (or whatever motor size you have)
RPM = 6200 (or redline for your motor)
VE = 1 Volumetric Efficiency is normally around 85-90% for a street build, but for sake of easy calculating and over estimating, we can go with 100%.

CFM = 95 X 6200 X 1 / 3456 = 170 cfm

That is the basic formula to figure out CFM needed for any build.

So at most on a 95'' built motor,, it only needs a filter that has 170 CFM, but U need a little more for when it get dirty, say250CFM to be safe.


Lets take a 88''er X 5800 X .85 /3456 = 125CFM --What a stock 88''er has.

For a Stg1 88'er U only need 125 CFM for Ur motor, That why the stock air filter is around 170 CFM, Even dirty it will still handle the motors needs..

So the, SE A/C has 287 CFM and will be over 100% more than enough Air flow.





.

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"Baffle them with brilliance, Dazzle them with Bullsh*t."
 
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Old Oct 12, 2012 | 11:03 AM
  #5  
BigMESA's Avatar
BigMESA
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Posts: 311
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From: South Carolina
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It's a 06 Night Train
with V&H short shorts. I really want it more for looks than performance.
 
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Old Oct 12, 2012 | 07:15 PM
  #6  
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TheTroupe
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From: New Hampshire
Default

Originally Posted by spydyr
Do you have aftermarket pipes? If so, then yes. Just an intake doesn't matter much because it's not helping the exhaust get out any faster.

This is not correct. The air intake has the most effect on the fuel air mix.

But to answer the OP question, if you have a true stage one intake and EFI flash you would be making a big difference force air cleaner because they really don't add a great deal of air volume.
 
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Old Oct 12, 2012 | 07:38 PM
  #7  
Warp Factor's Avatar
Warp Factor
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 3,217
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From: Detroit
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Originally Posted by TheTroupe
This is not correct. The air intake has the most effect on the fuel air mix.
Kinda sorta. Different air intakes will produce an effect much like an altitude or air density change, and the more recent fuel injection setups are pretty good at automatically adjusting for that.

What they may be less good at is adjusting for "hot spots" in in air flow, which are more likely to be produced by exhaust changes on a Harley, since Harleys generally don't have tuned-length intake runners.
 

Last edited by Warp Factor; Oct 12, 2012 at 07:52 PM.
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