Lugging under 2000 RPMs?
Lugging under 2000 RPMs?
I put a PCV on a couple of weeks ago, installed a map and now the bike runs much better than before. All I have in addition to the PCV is Rush performance slip-ons and a K&N high flow filter. I made extra adjustments at zero throttle and now, the bike has more power (especially at lower RPMs) and the popping is non-existent. My questions is this: Now that the engine has more power, am I doing harm by cruising at or even less than 2000 RPMs? Bike doesn't seem to lug, but I read somewhere where I am doing harm. I don't accelerate at 2000 while in 6th, just cruise. But bike seems to be smooth running? Thanks in advance.
Road Warrior
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,833
Likes: 35
From: Southern Maryland
.......i never worry too much about what RPM i ride in. if the engine starts to labor, shift it. i seldom even look at the tach. i just listen to it. i cruise in 6th most of the time sometimes down to 40 mph or so if its not laboring it but a lot of times, thats coming down from about 60. i'll downshift to pick up speed or if i'm riding a while at slower speed. its just like a manual car if you've ever driven one. not much difference in my opinion. quit worrying about the rpm and listen to the bike and ride it.
jmho
jmho
Last edited by cass; Jul 12, 2015 at 07:50 AM.
Extreme HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 14,744
Likes: 402
From: Phoenix '53, '88, '09 Big Twins
2000 rpms?
that's low and the damage which may occur will be the lower end bearings. so a complete rebuild.
Not tomorrow, but over time.
the twin cam doesn't have a heavy flywheel so forward rotational motion is not stored- the motion of the motor will surge if operated at too low an rpm- those surges will affect the load on the bearings, tather than a rotational motion ( on a film of oil separating the metal parts) there will be lateral loads on the bearings and less oil
2.) the engine will get hotter- oil pressure and volume are rpm dependent- oil lubricates the motor internals, carrying away heat to be dispersed- oil is also sprayed at the underside of the pistons and the cylinder bore to cool those hot parts ( this is why the twin cam idles at 1000 rpms for oil pressure)
3.)if you are not in the correct gear you will not be able to quickly accelerate away from a hazardous situation.
4.) you will also not be able to slow your speed with the throttle, you will have to use your brakes.
this heats up the brakes and they may be less effective if you suddenly need them, or they warp or pads wear out prematurely.
I sometimes notice that riders who have loud exhaust seem to be scared of their own noise and will upshift at a lower rpm than optimal.
you can look at any dyno chart and see for yourself where the power is made- where the motor is running more efficiently.
with any kinda of load 2800 rpms is where the power starts and these motors will run 4500+ rpms all day, no problem
mike
that's low and the damage which may occur will be the lower end bearings. so a complete rebuild.
Not tomorrow, but over time.
the twin cam doesn't have a heavy flywheel so forward rotational motion is not stored- the motion of the motor will surge if operated at too low an rpm- those surges will affect the load on the bearings, tather than a rotational motion ( on a film of oil separating the metal parts) there will be lateral loads on the bearings and less oil
2.) the engine will get hotter- oil pressure and volume are rpm dependent- oil lubricates the motor internals, carrying away heat to be dispersed- oil is also sprayed at the underside of the pistons and the cylinder bore to cool those hot parts ( this is why the twin cam idles at 1000 rpms for oil pressure)
3.)if you are not in the correct gear you will not be able to quickly accelerate away from a hazardous situation.
4.) you will also not be able to slow your speed with the throttle, you will have to use your brakes.
this heats up the brakes and they may be less effective if you suddenly need them, or they warp or pads wear out prematurely.
I sometimes notice that riders who have loud exhaust seem to be scared of their own noise and will upshift at a lower rpm than optimal.
you can look at any dyno chart and see for yourself where the power is made- where the motor is running more efficiently.
with any kinda of load 2800 rpms is where the power starts and these motors will run 4500+ rpms all day, no problem
mike
Last edited by mkguitar; Jul 12, 2015 at 10:21 AM.
Grand HDF Member
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 3,784
Likes: 100
From: Pasadena TX
I keep mine at or near 2k whatever the speed or gear. If it drops below that, I downshift. I have a 5 speed though, so maybe it's not an apple to apple comparison. My cam comes on real early right off idle, so I'm under the curve at 2k. At 75 mph I'm right at 3.2k, and 95% of the time I'm within that 1200 rpm range. Respectfully, why would you cruise at less than that? It's supposed to hammer your bearings, but that's just what I've read here.
Cruiser
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 182
Likes: 13
From: Ohio
"Lugging" at any rpm isn't good for the engine. There is nothing at all wrong with low rpm operation, when conditions permit, as long as engine load is light and throttle angle is low.
"Stock" engines have relatively "low" compression, and cams in them designed to produce a broad/flat torque curve. This makes for a user friendly end product, and these engines enjoy a broad rpm range where they are happy in. As long as you don't overheat them, or "ping" them, and do you maintenance as required, they last just about forever.
Even with that said, they are about like any other engine, if you "beat" on it, or "lug" the **** out of it all the time, you'll wear it out or break it sooner, vs operating it like you've got some sense.......FWIW......Cliff
"Stock" engines have relatively "low" compression, and cams in them designed to produce a broad/flat torque curve. This makes for a user friendly end product, and these engines enjoy a broad rpm range where they are happy in. As long as you don't overheat them, or "ping" them, and do you maintenance as required, they last just about forever.
Even with that said, they are about like any other engine, if you "beat" on it, or "lug" the **** out of it all the time, you'll wear it out or break it sooner, vs operating it like you've got some sense.......FWIW......Cliff
Club Member
Joined: Jul 2014
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From: Idaho
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Grand HDF Member
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 4,928
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From: Edmond Oklahoma
I disagree with the other poster, fuel creats the heat and riding at 2000 RPMs with low load is very little fuel. So long as the load is low, the engine is not struggling or surging, so it's fine.
Beary
Beary
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Cruiser
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 149
Likes: 0
From: Western PA
Exactly. If we would look at the hefty construction of a Cummins/Detroit compared to an HD there is absolutely no comparison.
Ever notice the equipment it takes just to lift a commercial diesel!!! Holy F!
Ever notice the equipment it takes just to lift a commercial diesel!!! Holy F!
Club Member
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 11,470
Likes: 3,572
From: Idaho
Har!
My riding buddy is a life-long CDL holder, drove everything from Greyhound bus to concrete mixer trucks.
He's a very experienced motorcycle rider, but it took some convincing before he began to believe that the redline on a twin cam isn't 2,200 rpm
All of the statements in this thread are, of course, personal opinions, because any statement regarding optimum or safe rpm depends on speed, load, grade, and most importantly, throttle position.
If you're climbing a long uphill grade in 100 degree heat, and you and the OL are pushing 500 pounds, and you're at full throttle and 2,000 rpm in 6th, your motor's gonna be hatin' on ya.
On the other hand, you can run 80 mph in 5th all day long, and the motor will last forever.
Somewhere in the middle is the sweet spot, depending.
My riding buddy is a life-long CDL holder, drove everything from Greyhound bus to concrete mixer trucks.
He's a very experienced motorcycle rider, but it took some convincing before he began to believe that the redline on a twin cam isn't 2,200 rpm
All of the statements in this thread are, of course, personal opinions, because any statement regarding optimum or safe rpm depends on speed, load, grade, and most importantly, throttle position.
If you're climbing a long uphill grade in 100 degree heat, and you and the OL are pushing 500 pounds, and you're at full throttle and 2,000 rpm in 6th, your motor's gonna be hatin' on ya.
On the other hand, you can run 80 mph in 5th all day long, and the motor will last forever.
Somewhere in the middle is the sweet spot, depending.