why doesn't harley fix their problems ?
Grand HDF Member
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 4,726
Likes: 1,787
From: Toledo ohio
I agree with some of the commenter that a lot of the mechanical problems are self induced. I knew when I bought this King, that it was going to be with me a long time. I have babied it for the most part, driving normal 95% of the time. Once in a while I will get on it through a tunnel but not too hard. People that put in $$ hopping up the motors really get on them for the fun of it all. That takes a toll on the rest of the componants. Like one commmenter said about his Dad telling him, you bought a race bike, get used to it (failures and repairs)
Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 6,899
Likes: 3,412
From: OH
I have had the wheel bearing issue but it was a cheap fix. The Compensators.... I had one that was questionable but I have gotten 50k with no issues out of another. 22k on the one in the bike and no issues. The air cleaners sobing oil is and end user induced problem.
Harley has 3 classes of rider. 1) the low mileage rider 2) the high mileage riders 3) the tinkering riders (engine or electrical). Number 1 makes up the majority and makes the company the most money. The other 2 are lesser in numbers and where most of the problems come up IMO
Harley has 3 classes of rider. 1) the low mileage rider 2) the high mileage riders 3) the tinkering riders (engine or electrical). Number 1 makes up the majority and makes the company the most money. The other 2 are lesser in numbers and where most of the problems come up IMO
Last edited by todd-67; May 1, 2017 at 10:59 AM.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 32,851
Likes: 17,888
From: Newcastle, OK
i'm on my 7th hd. never have I had any of those problems with the exception of the breather bolts on my sportster leaking after I did a se stage 1. I knew it was going to happen, so I wasn't upset about it, took it as a response to what I did. I alleviated the problem by sticking a maxi pad in the bottom of my ham can. changed it out at every oil change.
otherwise, I've had a couple of problems that were taken care of during warranty, but nothing that I've read that would be considered 'chronic'.
otherwise, I've had a couple of problems that were taken care of during warranty, but nothing that I've read that would be considered 'chronic'.
Guys like me that have been riding for 50+ years get very tired of this kind of attitude. I have probably ridden more types and brands of motorcycles than you have years riding.
Sucks when someone calls out your favorite brand for what it truly is. Harley's are fine bikes but so are many others. When a Harley is running right, it's a really nice machine. The problem isn't the bike itself as much as it's Moco. "hardheaded" seems to be conveying this in his post if you read it carefully. My buddies I have had these same talks more than once over the years so "hardheaded isn't alone.
No one spending the ransom that HD demands should have the overall problems they have and the problems are well known and documented.
Ini cam bearings: A well known weakness back in the EVO days and still being used today! Had Moco switched to the Torrington for a few bucks each, the issue would have dissapeared but that would mean a couple bucks off their thousands per bike. Inexcusable.
TC88's: Original cam tensioner system was and is probably one of the worst engineering designs to come down the pipeline and they continued using it for six years!!! This is the new millenium and this is what HD gives us for our thousands of dollars.
The newer hydraulic design is just a bandaid. You still have to open the cam chest at some point to inspect and they continued using it for 10 years!!! Something I will never have to do on my Road Star.
And the list could go on. Known problems tha Moco refuses to address and it's all for their bottom line and shareholders. At least the US auto industry woke up.
S&S and all the other aftermarket companies love Moco. Why wouldn't they? This cottage industry is making millions because of it.
As far as "enjoy your new Yamaha" goes, I am not a bike snob. Have owned several trouble free Yamahas and loved every one of them. I always have several bikes on hand to ride at any time including my Road King. My current Yamaha rides are a '09 Road Star with 8K on the clock that I just picked up and '08 Royal Star Venture I got with 5K on the clock, now 103K on it. Of all the bikes I have ever owned, the RS Venture is the finest riding bike I ever strapped a leg over. There is no other bike produced that I will consider for 2 up riding. Yeah, it's that nice. And I have ridden lots of bikes. I still had to change the oil, tires and batteries over the years though. Even had a flat rear tire one year. Can you believe it? (Still have to call Yamaha about that problem). $6,000.00 for a 5k mile bike with 7 years and 98K miles on the sweetest trouble free touring bike I ever experienced. Kind of justifies why Yamaha has been number one in consumer satisfaction and reliability.
Stop directing your attitude toward fellow riders and direct it towards Moco where it should belong. So, go ahead, tell people like "hardheaded", a hard core Harley guy, to stop complaining and go buy a Yamaha. You know maybe he will and he won't be sorry , but Harley will be. I know a lot of former Harley guys who have moved on because of their neglect.
Sucks when someone calls out your favorite brand for what it truly is. Harley's are fine bikes but so are many others. When a Harley is running right, it's a really nice machine. The problem isn't the bike itself as much as it's Moco. "hardheaded" seems to be conveying this in his post if you read it carefully. My buddies I have had these same talks more than once over the years so "hardheaded isn't alone.
No one spending the ransom that HD demands should have the overall problems they have and the problems are well known and documented.
Ini cam bearings: A well known weakness back in the EVO days and still being used today! Had Moco switched to the Torrington for a few bucks each, the issue would have dissapeared but that would mean a couple bucks off their thousands per bike. Inexcusable.
TC88's: Original cam tensioner system was and is probably one of the worst engineering designs to come down the pipeline and they continued using it for six years!!! This is the new millenium and this is what HD gives us for our thousands of dollars.
The newer hydraulic design is just a bandaid. You still have to open the cam chest at some point to inspect and they continued using it for 10 years!!! Something I will never have to do on my Road Star.
And the list could go on. Known problems tha Moco refuses to address and it's all for their bottom line and shareholders. At least the US auto industry woke up.
S&S and all the other aftermarket companies love Moco. Why wouldn't they? This cottage industry is making millions because of it.
As far as "enjoy your new Yamaha" goes, I am not a bike snob. Have owned several trouble free Yamahas and loved every one of them. I always have several bikes on hand to ride at any time including my Road King. My current Yamaha rides are a '09 Road Star with 8K on the clock that I just picked up and '08 Royal Star Venture I got with 5K on the clock, now 103K on it. Of all the bikes I have ever owned, the RS Venture is the finest riding bike I ever strapped a leg over. There is no other bike produced that I will consider for 2 up riding. Yeah, it's that nice. And I have ridden lots of bikes. I still had to change the oil, tires and batteries over the years though. Even had a flat rear tire one year. Can you believe it? (Still have to call Yamaha about that problem). $6,000.00 for a 5k mile bike with 7 years and 98K miles on the sweetest trouble free touring bike I ever experienced. Kind of justifies why Yamaha has been number one in consumer satisfaction and reliability.
Stop directing your attitude toward fellow riders and direct it towards Moco where it should belong. So, go ahead, tell people like "hardheaded", a hard core Harley guy, to stop complaining and go buy a Yamaha. You know maybe he will and he won't be sorry , but Harley will be. I know a lot of former Harley guys who have moved on because of their neglect.
Last edited by ChickinOnaChain; May 1, 2017 at 02:43 PM.
Grand HDF Member
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 4,459
Likes: 2,896
From: Oklahoma
I suspect there is a lot that goes on that we don't see. Harley issues a spec for wheel bearings and companies bid. Harley selects one (we don't know the criteria for the selection) and then the company cheaps out on bearings below spec. How many bikes get built before the warranty claims begin? How many warranty repairs before Harley decides to change vendors? In a forum like this we hear about all the bad wheel bearings long after Harley has changed vendors.
The compensator went through several design changes. On the 4th or 5th try the design looks good but whoever is supplying springs is not very quality conscious. Has Harley changed vendors for the springs? WE don't know, but it is Harley that gets the black eye for the vendor's poor QC.
Bean counters do run things but they are not responsible for contractors cheating on specs. I would hope that no supplier who has let down Harley gets a second chance, but that is one more thing WE don't know about. How much on that list was actually manufactured by Harley?
The compensator went through several design changes. On the 4th or 5th try the design looks good but whoever is supplying springs is not very quality conscious. Has Harley changed vendors for the springs? WE don't know, but it is Harley that gets the black eye for the vendor's poor QC.
Bean counters do run things but they are not responsible for contractors cheating on specs. I would hope that no supplier who has let down Harley gets a second chance, but that is one more thing WE don't know about. How much on that list was actually manufactured by Harley?
Tourer
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 394
Likes: 29
From: Georgia
My 2008 FLHT has been remarkably void of any issues. The "fretting wires" a couple months ago was the only one that caused any ACTUAL performance issues. There was a TSB on it and the fix cured the problem. My speedometer was replaced in 2008 when I rode up the the 105th Anniversary bash in the solid rain. That was a real "trial-by-fire" though. GA to Milwaukee in the rain will do that to any bike though.
Ben
Ben
Thread Starter
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Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 11,226
Likes: 3,049
From: St.Louis Mo.
I know you read about all of those issues on the forums.
But the truth is, 99% of the HD bikes out there do not have any of those issues.
I put 48,000 miles on a 2011 Street Glide, without a single issue.
My '15 Limited only has about 20,000 miles so far, but sill not a single issue.
Not gonna say I won't have a major issue tomorrow, but I am willing to take that chance.
No matter who the manufacturer is, they will all have some of their products with issues.
And those with issues will always post about them on forums.
Those without any issues are much less likely to post about the lack of issues.
But the truth is, 99% of the HD bikes out there do not have any of those issues.
I put 48,000 miles on a 2011 Street Glide, without a single issue.
My '15 Limited only has about 20,000 miles so far, but sill not a single issue.
Not gonna say I won't have a major issue tomorrow, but I am willing to take that chance.
No matter who the manufacturer is, they will all have some of their products with issues.
And those with issues will always post about them on forums.
Those without any issues are much less likely to post about the lack of issues.
Last edited by hardheaded; May 1, 2017 at 01:03 PM.
Grand HDF Member
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 4,585
Likes: 673
From: Rolla
i didn't just "read " about these issues on forums. i've had first hand witnessed these problems. maindrive gear bearing at 12,000 miles, front wheel bearings at 2500 miles, oil leak at rear cyl. base, oil leak at filter mount, bad lifter, radio locking up when i first bought my trike and other issues on my last three new bikes. this is just on my bikes. i've seen friends with bad pinion gear and it took out the entire engine. another friend with a bad wrist pin on a brand new streeglide (2014). they replaced the entire engine on it. one more friend had the flywheels shift in his engine and it sounded like there were angry beavers inside it eating it up. he had to eat the cost on this as it was out of warrenty. couldn't tell you how many people i've known change out their compensators. one more guy stuck a valve and it wasn't good. these are life long friends of mine, not just someone i was shooting the breeze with in a bar with. so you see these are real issues. no one is bitching , i just think they could do better. i hope no one ever has a problem with their bike, wouldn't that be great !
I am not saying for one minute they are problem free 100% of the time.
Nobody has built such a bike, and nobody ever will.
But I have never experienced any of those issues, and nobody I know that has an HD has either.
Of course there are some out there that have, just as you have noticed.
But the fact remains, that 99% of HD bikes out there do NOT have the issues you mention.
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 2,172
Likes: 377
From: Georgia
I am one of those who`s done with Harley, after riding all of my life from the age of 16. The final straw was when a woman did a right cross in front of me a couple of years ago. I went down after swerving out of the way of a collision when my front tire washed out due to some pea gravel. Long story short, I was lucky and her insurance paid out AFTER the bike estimate was figured. Here`s the rub. I had to pay for estimates where I took the bike to two Harley shops for comparison. These estimates weren`t cheap either (IMO, they should have been free); they cost nearly $200 each. That in itself wasn`t the worst part. The bike had minor damage to the engine guard, a bent left side floorboard and some scrape on the left side of the gas tank and left rear fender. I figured even with CVO paint and the repair of minor damages to the left side, it would have been no more than $8K. BOTH of these shops listed so many bogus things that virtually everything that could be listed, WAS. This resulted in an estimate so high that both shops totaled my bike. I had already been making payments on it for a year, which came to over $4K. This turned out to be a loss, because if I wanted to keep the bike I would have had only a salvage title with two more years of payments to make. I also had an extended warranty in which I had to jump through so many hoops to get paid for the unused portion of it, that it took about 6 months to receive it. So, I opted to collect the difference between the payoff and the appraised value, and I was done. This was a really dirty deal in which I believe the MoCo instructs their dealers to do so they will sell more bikes. They are just corporate thugs who are too greedy. A long time ago it seemed the company was truly interesting in serving the customer, but no more. I no longer have a bike, because I`m at the age that if I had another wreck I probably would be too old to heal properly. And with the inattention of drivers today, I decided to call it quits for a motorcycle. I miss riding though, but for me this is the best decision......
Since when is it the victims responsibility to have the vehicle damage appraised? That lies with the insurance company, theirs or yours. If you choose to have another one, or two, done then that's on you. And I certainly wouldn't expect a shop to spend the time to thoroughly inspect, price and write up an estimate for free. I can see two or three hours of shop time being involved.
As far as totalling the bike, my guess is that's far more of a liability issue than greed. And of course they're going to list everything. How upset would a repair customer be to find out they had to pay hundreds or thousands more because the appraiser wasn't through enough?
ESP, any ESP, is a pita to deal with. It's taken me weeks to just get the ownership transferred to me. It's not just HD.
It's unfortunate that you have chosen not to ride but I guess it's understandable considering. Have you given any thought to a trike or something like a CanAm?
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Tourer
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 416
Likes: 14
From: Texas
Guys like me that have been riding for 50+ years get very tired of this kind of attitude. I have probably ridden more types and brands of motorcycles than you have years riding.
Sucks when someone calls out your favorite brand for what it truly is. Harley's are fine bikes but so are many others. When a Harley is running right, it's a really nice machine. The problem isn't the bike itself as much as it's Moco. "hardheaded" seems to be conveying this in his post if you read it carefully. My buddies I have had these same talks more than once over the years so "hardheaded isn't alone.
No one spending the ransom that HD demands should have the overall problems they have and the problems are well known and documented.
Ini cam bearings: A well known weakness back in the EVO days and still being used today! Had Moco switched to the Torrington for a few bucks each, the issue would have dissapeared but that would mean a couple bucks off their thousands per bike. Inexcusable.
TC88's: Original cam tensioner system was and is probably one of the worst engineering designs to come down the pipeline and they continued using it for six years!!! This is the new millenium and this is what HD gives us for our thousands of dollars.
The newer hydraulic design is just a bandaid. You still have to open the cam chest at some point to inspect and they continued using it for 10 years!!! Something I will never have to do on my Road Star.
And the list could go on. Known problems tha Moco refuses to address and it's all for their bottom line and shareholders. At least the US auto industry woke up.
S&S and all the other aftermarket companies love Moco. Why wouldn't they? This cottage industry is making millions because of it.
As far as "enjoy your new Yamaha" goes, I am not a bike snob. Have owned several trouble free Yamahas and loved every one of them. I always have several bikes on hand to ride at any time including my Road King. My current Yamaha rides are a '09 Road Star with 8K on the clock that I just picked up and '08 Royal Star Venture I got with 5K on the clock, now 103K on it. Of all the bikes I have ever owned, the RS Venture is the finest riding bike I ever strapped a leg over. There is no other bike produced that I will consider for 2 up riding. Yeah, it's that nice. And I have ridden lots of bikes. I still had to change the oil, tires and batteries over the years though. Even had a flat rear tire one year. Can you believe it? (Still have to call Yamaha about that problem). $6,000.00 for a 5k mile bike with 7 years and 98K miles on the sweetest trouble free touring bike I ever experienced. Kind of justifies why Yamaha has been number one in consumer satisfaction and reliability.
Stop directing your attitude toward fellow riders and direct it towards Moco where it should belong. So, go ahead, tell people like "hardheaded", a hard core Harley guy, to stop complaining and go buy a Yamaha. You know maybe he will and he won't be sorry , but Harley will be. I know a lot of former Harley guys who have moved on because of their neglect.
Sucks when someone calls out your favorite brand for what it truly is. Harley's are fine bikes but so are many others. When a Harley is running right, it's a really nice machine. The problem isn't the bike itself as much as it's Moco. "hardheaded" seems to be conveying this in his post if you read it carefully. My buddies I have had these same talks more than once over the years so "hardheaded isn't alone.
No one spending the ransom that HD demands should have the overall problems they have and the problems are well known and documented.
Ini cam bearings: A well known weakness back in the EVO days and still being used today! Had Moco switched to the Torrington for a few bucks each, the issue would have dissapeared but that would mean a couple bucks off their thousands per bike. Inexcusable.
TC88's: Original cam tensioner system was and is probably one of the worst engineering designs to come down the pipeline and they continued using it for six years!!! This is the new millenium and this is what HD gives us for our thousands of dollars.
The newer hydraulic design is just a bandaid. You still have to open the cam chest at some point to inspect and they continued using it for 10 years!!! Something I will never have to do on my Road Star.
And the list could go on. Known problems tha Moco refuses to address and it's all for their bottom line and shareholders. At least the US auto industry woke up.
S&S and all the other aftermarket companies love Moco. Why wouldn't they? This cottage industry is making millions because of it.
As far as "enjoy your new Yamaha" goes, I am not a bike snob. Have owned several trouble free Yamahas and loved every one of them. I always have several bikes on hand to ride at any time including my Road King. My current Yamaha rides are a '09 Road Star with 8K on the clock that I just picked up and '08 Royal Star Venture I got with 5K on the clock, now 103K on it. Of all the bikes I have ever owned, the RS Venture is the finest riding bike I ever strapped a leg over. There is no other bike produced that I will consider for 2 up riding. Yeah, it's that nice. And I have ridden lots of bikes. I still had to change the oil, tires and batteries over the years though. Even had a flat rear tire one year. Can you believe it? (Still have to call Yamaha about that problem). $6,000.00 for a 5k mile bike with 7 years and 98K miles on the sweetest trouble free touring bike I ever experienced. Kind of justifies why Yamaha has been number one in consumer satisfaction and reliability.
Stop directing your attitude toward fellow riders and direct it towards Moco where it should belong. So, go ahead, tell people like "hardheaded", a hard core Harley guy, to stop complaining and go buy a Yamaha. You know maybe he will and he won't be sorry , but Harley will be. I know a lot of former Harley guys who have moved on because of their neglect.
Last edited by tsigwing; May 2, 2017 at 07:04 AM.
Thread Starter
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Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 11,226
Likes: 3,049
From: St.Louis Mo.
i have a friend who dates a gal that is part owner of a harley dealership close by. we have become close friends with one of the mechanics there. he can tell you some stories of the many things that happen to these bikes and what to watch out for. they are not playing cards in back of the shop , they are working on bikes. what's good about this is we do get some inside information out of them about problems they are seeing on the bikes.