WOW, Explain this one!
Road Master
Joined: Jul 2007
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From: Dover, DE
I have an 07 Street Glide did the SE Breather and Rinehart True Duals and Stage 1 download, no fuel management..bike runs fine, no poping on decel. I happy with performance. True duals actually made it run quite a bit cooler.
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Is'nt that about the same you get with a just plain old stage 1 kit? Seems that is like the way to go. I have never had any heat issues in 15000 miles tah made me jump up and try to re engineer the bike. The only heat I have a felt was being stuck in traffic at Laconia, then I just shut it down.
If I'm not mistaken, full Stage 1 (as most people do them) also includes the computer piggy back device like the Power Commander etc. Here we're talking about just mufflers and a/c unit without the computer piggy back upgrade. According to the article, the bike runs as stock (on the dyno test) with noted increases in power and torque. The big difference that I see in NO noted increase in heat due to "leaness" of the a/f ratio as the motor ran in the normal stock range. Not everybody wants to mod their EFI so this could be a good thing for us.
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From: Yokohama
February 2009 issue of "American Bagger" magazine
In the "TECH" article, they take a stock 2009 Street Glide and do a step by step install of D&Ds Boss Kit which is comprised of D&D Boss slip on mufflers and a Zippers high flow air cleaner assembly. The end result is a Dyno run that shows an increase of roughly 7 H.P. and 5 Ft. Lbs of Torque. The dyno run sheet is published and here's the interesting part.
No modification was made to the EFI itself, no aftermarket controller and you know what? The a/f ratio was good throughout the entire dyno run. The ratio barely went over 15 between 3000 and 3800 RPMs and I mean barely. The rest of the RPM range was at normal, between 14 and under 15.
Does this tell us that we can do these mods without installing EFI add on computers? It certainly seems to. To me, this article is eye opening... For those of us who don't want to jeopardize our factory warranties, maybe this is the answer. I just ordered new slip ons, not I gotta' look for one of these Zipper air filter assys.
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In the "TECH" article, they take a stock 2009 Street Glide and do a step by step install of D&Ds Boss Kit which is comprised of D&D Boss slip on mufflers and a Zippers high flow air cleaner assembly. The end result is a Dyno run that shows an increase of roughly 7 H.P. and 5 Ft. Lbs of Torque. The dyno run sheet is published and here's the interesting part.
No modification was made to the EFI itself, no aftermarket controller and you know what? The a/f ratio was good throughout the entire dyno run. The ratio barely went over 15 between 3000 and 3800 RPMs and I mean barely. The rest of the RPM range was at normal, between 14 and under 15.
Does this tell us that we can do these mods without installing EFI add on computers? It certainly seems to. To me, this article is eye opening... For those of us who don't want to jeopardize our factory warranties, maybe this is the answer. I just ordered new slip ons, not I gotta' look for one of these Zipper air filter assys.
Comments?
Last edited by Twinrider; Jan 27, 2009 at 06:32 AM.
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Joined: Jun 2007
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From: Tallahassee, Fl
I think this is really good news in black and white (for once) as it demonstrates that the a/f remains near or at stock, even with the mufflers and high flow a/c.
I really didnt want to modify my EFI with a controller. I know they have their added benefits but technically render the bike illegal (emmissions) and could void your factory warranty too. MOCO isnt in a position be be generious now which adds to the concern.
I really didnt want to modify my EFI with a controller. I know they have their added benefits but technically render the bike illegal (emmissions) and could void your factory warranty too. MOCO isnt in a position be be generious now which adds to the concern.
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From: Augusta, GA
With an AFR above 13.5 I bet the rear head temps are well above 400F.
I sure hope those concerned about warranty issues have talked to the dealer so you don't get burned when you run without fuel management.
I sure hope those concerned about warranty issues have talked to the dealer so you don't get burned when you run without fuel management.
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Adding the fuel management system is not going to VOID your warranty. They are installing them at HD dealers all over the place. Whether it be their own SERT, Stage 1 download, PC III's or V's or the Vance & Hines Fuel Pack. IF you talk to MOST service mgrs. they will tell you that you need something IF you add the high flow A/C.
Service managers and the Service dept. in general (like any auto dealership too) are in business to make money. of course they're going to recommend and try to sell you stuff. Besides, that all used to be true, before the 2008 models you definitely needed it, but it appears that on the 09s especially, you do not.
Last edited by RODEO; Jan 27, 2009 at 06:42 AM.
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Lots of myths floating around, lots of here say, but this is finally some proof in black and white that the stock bike adapts for the mufflers and a/c unit to run just like stock..
Last edited by RODEO; Jan 27, 2009 at 06:50 AM.
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From: Augusta, GA
HD set these 09 bikes up to run at 14.7 So if you keep your bike totally stock, HD has to stand behind that and that much heat generation too. 13.5 could void your warranty, should they detect that modification. If fuel management add ons were necessary, it would come from the factory with it. Besides, I doubt that American bagger and D&D would publish such a straigh forward article if there were more too it. They claim its a simple add on that adds power and torque without any other problems.
The computers are learning computers, there have been many articles before the one you refer to that confirm that BUT, the fact remains you are not keeping your bike factory stock SO any assumption that you are better off regarding warranty issues than someone that had their dealer/indy install a SERT or some piggyback unit to cool the bike down is without merit.
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You need to pay attention to what you're trying to sell to others or hope they aren't.
The computers are learning computers, there have been many articles before the one you refer to that confirm that BUT, the fact remains you are not keeping your bike factory stock SO any assumption that you are better off regarding warranty issues than someone that had their dealer/indy install a SERT or some piggyback unit to cool the bike down is without merit.
The computers are learning computers, there have been many articles before the one you refer to that confirm that BUT, the fact remains you are not keeping your bike factory stock SO any assumption that you are better off regarding warranty issues than someone that had their dealer/indy install a SERT or some piggyback unit to cool the bike down is without merit.
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From: Augusta, GA
Granted, changing the mufflers and a/c are modifications all by themself. Yes, technically they might also void your warranty. However the mufflers I chose are made by HD and are 50 state legal. I may or may not upgrade my a/c or I may just replace the element itself with one from K&N. (I heard that unless you are running into the upper RPM ranges, that the a/c upgrade doesnt help anyway and I myself rarely run that high RPMs.) However, all that being said, doing a "piggy back" controller is more of a major modification which directy affects the EFI. MOCO is going to take issue with that much more then simple slip on mufflers alone. There's been other threads about this issue too and adding the "piggy back" is being noted when you have your bikes serviced at the Dealers and MOCO could use that against you later on. No one will keep track of your slip ons..
I also learned that having all repairs done @ your local dealer is the only place to have work done, even if it means towing several hundred miles to do so.