this re-mapping deal ? scam ?
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Jan 2010
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From: earth
https://www.hdforums.com/forum/attac...1&d=1326381008
this is just a simplified drawing of a fuel injection system with basic sensors shown and ECU instead of ECM. the MAP is the sensor in the throttle body that tells the computer about fuel air mixtures. when you go with a stage 1 set up you change the volume of air going into the engine and a tuner can allow you to go in and change things that a small screw driver would with a carb. The advantage is that on some dyno machines its all incorporated so you can make changes on the fly while the bike is running rather than riding for 15 minutes and hooking up and making changes....anyway, any time you increase the amount of air intake and exhaust, add cams etc...the MAP needs to be corrected so the engine will be more effective and efficient.
this is just a simplified drawing of a fuel injection system with basic sensors shown and ECU instead of ECM. the MAP is the sensor in the throttle body that tells the computer about fuel air mixtures. when you go with a stage 1 set up you change the volume of air going into the engine and a tuner can allow you to go in and change things that a small screw driver would with a carb. The advantage is that on some dyno machines its all incorporated so you can make changes on the fly while the bike is running rather than riding for 15 minutes and hooking up and making changes....anyway, any time you increase the amount of air intake and exhaust, add cams etc...the MAP needs to be corrected so the engine will be more effective and efficient.
Road Warrior
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,468
Likes: 4
From: South Carolina
Bro, the MAP, Manifold Absolute Pressure sensor is but one input sensor that feeds data to the ECM to interpret and make fine adjustments during operation, it is not what folks are talking when they say they need to adjust the "map". They are talking about the air/fuel "map", or blueprint, or table, that is ajusted to bring the A/F result back to a desireable range after a change has been made to the motor. Understand that the Manifold Absolute Pressure sensor is neither adjustable or adjusted as method of tuning HD EFI. Not to be mean but you have no idea what you are talking about, you really need to read up on basic fuel injection and try again.
i was thinking you were manipulating input results, scan rates, outputs and sensor over rides in a closed loop system that could mimic an open loop at times. And also since the Manifold absolute pressure sensor is kinda the hero of the system, it was named after him....I feel better now. thank you for fixing me....
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Cruiser
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 245
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From: my house
Stop reading more into it or changing around what the original question was for a minute ....my whole point was , we're not changing cams, or throttle bodies, or even intakes,, I'm talking about (just an air FILTER change)...... so if a different AIR FILTER adds that much more air ,,, they are either putting on a totally restrictive piece of crap breather on stock that is choking the engine to start with ,,, or its hype ,,,,
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 2,916
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From: earth
Stop reading more into it or changing around what the original question was for a minute ....my whole point was , we're not changing cams, or throttle bodies, or even intakes,, I'm talking about (just an air FILTER change)...... so if a different AIR FILTER adds that much more air ,,, they are either putting on a totally restrictive piece of crap breather on stock that is choking the engine to start with ,,, or its hype ,,,,
Extreme HDF Member
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 10,216
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From: Glendale AZ
Ok, how many different ways do you need it explained, the stock air filter/air cleaner is restictive. It is almost completely enclosed to mitigate noise for EPA compliance, save for the small air inlet coupled with an undersized low profile filter, so again it is restrictive. For someone with 30 years experience building drag racing motors, I wouldn't think it too dificult to grab a pencil and paper and calculate the raw air requirement and then compare it to the rated flow of the stock air filter. Are you sure you didn't just read a book by someone else who built drag motors for 30 years?
Tourer
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 374
Likes: 5
From: Overland Park, Ks
Well, I'm not a drag racer or an engine builder but noticed this on the HD site when I was buying a new CVO Street Glide.
2012 Street Glide CVO torque = 118 Ft-Lbs.
2012 Road Glide CVO torque = 122 Ft-Lbs.
Only difference power plant wise is the air breather. So I think it is safe to say for one, some stock air breathers are more restrictive than others and two, at least to some degree, it is not entirely EPA regulated. Seams as though style and function has some roll. IE you can't put a snorkle breather on a bike with lower fairings. My 2cents.
2012 Street Glide CVO torque = 118 Ft-Lbs.
2012 Road Glide CVO torque = 122 Ft-Lbs.
Only difference power plant wise is the air breather. So I think it is safe to say for one, some stock air breathers are more restrictive than others and two, at least to some degree, it is not entirely EPA regulated. Seams as though style and function has some roll. IE you can't put a snorkle breather on a bike with lower fairings. My 2cents.
Road Master
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 885
Likes: 14
From: SoCal
Hold on....I'm getting the popcorn now!!!!
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Road Master
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 816
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From: Michigan
Ok, how many different ways do you need it explained, the stock air filter/air cleaner is restictive. It is almost completely enclosed to mitigate noise for EPA compliance, save for the small air inlet coupled with an undersized low profile filter, so again it is restrictive. For someone with 30 years experience building drag racing motors, I wouldn't think it too dificult to grab a pencil and paper and calculate the raw air requirement and then compare it to the rated flow of the stock air filter. Are you sure you didn't just read a book by someone else who built drag motors for 30 years?
C'mon man, tell him what you really think.
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Cruiser
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 245
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From: my house
fabrik8tr, i have read many posts on here from many posters who alway try to help each other out , but it seems everytime you type something , you have to have a condescending attitude, and as Tucci said talk down to others like you are the one all knowing modern day Einstein..and I know I'm not the only one who feels that way ..... so do me a favor , from now on when I post a question, please refrain from answering, with your degrading nasty attitude .. ..and yes I just read a book about how to build race engines.. it was on the shelf next to the one you read called... how to know everything about everything there is to know ......... thank god they have an option for allowing the blocking of certain posters posts ...i'm using mine right now .........have a nice day
Last edited by blockzilla; Jan 12, 2012 at 01:08 PM.