Fuel Management for Idiots
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 2,206
Likes: 0
From:
You can get away without fuel management if you only do the air filter or the pipes, but not both.
The Power Commander V would be a good one to get in case you do any other engine mods.
If you wanna go cheaper yet and don't intend on doing any other engine mods, you could get the V&H Fuelpak like me.
The Power Commander V would be a good one to get in case you do any other engine mods.
If you wanna go cheaper yet and don't intend on doing any other engine mods, you could get the V&H Fuelpak like me.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 17,148
Likes: 6,171
From: SE Michigan
The truth is you can do pipes and AC and the ECM and sensors will adjust, anyone who says it will run too lean and blow up is just wrong. Now, that said, what the ECM adjusts it back to is the same lean-ness of the EPA spec.
So if you want a fuel management system, there are a lot of choices. They do 2 basic things (there's a lot more complexity under each, but really its 2 major things) 1) adjust/modify Air Fuel Ratio (AFR - how rich/lean), and optimize performance (timing, VE tables, advance, etc)
For a basic overview of the *kinds* of options there are, you can start here: http://www.nightrider.com/biketech/m...i_upgrades.htm
So if you want a fuel management system, there are a lot of choices. They do 2 basic things (there's a lot more complexity under each, but really its 2 major things) 1) adjust/modify Air Fuel Ratio (AFR - how rich/lean), and optimize performance (timing, VE tables, advance, etc)
For a basic overview of the *kinds* of options there are, you can start here: http://www.nightrider.com/biketech/m...i_upgrades.htm
Extreme HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 14,744
Likes: 402
From: Phoenix '53, '88, '09 Big Twins
welcome to the maze...
I stumbled into a while ago, after about mastering carb tuning- i have some automotive training.
on my bike ( 09 FLHTC) which i bought with 5000 miles, the motor would ping under certain repeatable conditions ; 6% grades between 2800~3200 rpms.
I used nightrider.com XIEDS to solve that ( $125 and done).
From there I changed to hi flow mufflers for a 1000 miles, with good result, then put on my ness big sucker and have been fine for many thousands of mile under varying conditions.
many riders have good results with out xieds, reflash, tuner etc.
In my case the ping problem needed to be addressed first to prolong the service life and reliability of my motor.
Pinging sounds like peebles rattling in a coffee can, and is most likely to occur under high heat/ high load ( pulling up a hill, sudden acceleration) conditions.
Good Luck, Mike
I stumbled into a while ago, after about mastering carb tuning- i have some automotive training.
on my bike ( 09 FLHTC) which i bought with 5000 miles, the motor would ping under certain repeatable conditions ; 6% grades between 2800~3200 rpms.
I used nightrider.com XIEDS to solve that ( $125 and done).
From there I changed to hi flow mufflers for a 1000 miles, with good result, then put on my ness big sucker and have been fine for many thousands of mile under varying conditions.
many riders have good results with out xieds, reflash, tuner etc.
In my case the ping problem needed to be addressed first to prolong the service life and reliability of my motor.
Pinging sounds like peebles rattling in a coffee can, and is most likely to occur under high heat/ high load ( pulling up a hill, sudden acceleration) conditions.
Good Luck, Mike
Stellar HDF Member
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 3,156
Likes: 41
From: So Cal
The truth is you can do pipes and AC and the ECM and sensors will adjust, anyone who says it will run too lean and blow up is just wrong. Now, that said, what the ECM adjusts it back to is the same lean-ness of the EPA spec.
So if you want a fuel management system, there are a lot of choices. They do 2 basic things (there's a lot more complexity under each, but really its 2 major things) 1) adjust/modify Air Fuel Ratio (AFR - how rich/lean), and optimize performance (timing, VE tables, advance, etc)
For a basic overview of the *kinds* of options there are, you can start here: http://www.nightrider.com/biketech/m...i_upgrades.htm
So if you want a fuel management system, there are a lot of choices. They do 2 basic things (there's a lot more complexity under each, but really its 2 major things) 1) adjust/modify Air Fuel Ratio (AFR - how rich/lean), and optimize performance (timing, VE tables, advance, etc)
For a basic overview of the *kinds* of options there are, you can start here: http://www.nightrider.com/biketech/m...i_upgrades.htm
In short if you want the bike to run cooler and better by getting it out of the EPA lean zone you have a couple basic categories of tuners
1. piggyback tuners, PC, Fuel Pak, DFO , Cobra etc. They are less $ but stay on the bike in in some cases have limitations in that they may only be fuelers and not be able to adjust the timing etc
2. Flash Tuners , SERT, SESPT, TTS, Power Vision. These tuners all have the ability to flash a different MAP to the ECM . This allows full ability to tune the bike , fuel and timing and set many other parameters. They don't stay on the bike.
Ive used both and Im currently using the Power Vision from Fuel Moto and find it the easiest tuner yet with a great deal of flexibility.
Your riding the top of the line bike don't skimp out at the last piece of the puzzle IMO
Thread Starter
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Cruiser
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 108
Likes: 0
From: Seattle Washington
So I am thinking mabe I should pony up for something like the Power Commander to cover my *** and be able to do things later if I so desire. Can I just do A generic map or do I really need the Dyno. Seems like the dealers figure everybody has unlimited cash and will gladly take it from you. Not that I don't trust them but it's easy to spend someone else's $. Also, any issues with the HD warranty? What about HD's tuner.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 17,148
Likes: 6,171
From: SE Michigan
So I am thinking mabe I should pony up for something like the Power Commander to cover my *** and be able to do things later if I so desire. Can I just do A generic map or do I really need the Dyno. Seems like the dealers figure everybody has unlimited cash and will gladly take it from you. Not that I don't trust them but it's easy to spend someone else's $. Also, any issues with the HD warranty? What about HD's tuner.
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Cruiser
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 108
Likes: 0
From: Seattle Washington
I will call Fuel Moto and talk to them. I guess I am just not familiar with their product. I just want to make sure that when I take my bike into my local dealer they know what to do with it. I know they deal with HD's and Power Commander. But I really like the idea of getting the info. from the source. Plus supporting an independent business. And thanks everyone, I appreciate the input.
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Put the ac on and if it runs ok drive it. I posted some dyno sheet yesterday of an 08 RG I had that actually richened up (under full throttle) when I put D&D 2:1 and ac on it. I will probably run somewhat better with a tuner, but not much.
Stellar HDF Member
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 3,156
Likes: 41
From: So Cal
I will call Fuel Moto and talk to them. I guess I am just not familiar with their product. I just want to make sure that when I take my bike into my local dealer they know what to do with it. I know they deal with HD's and Power Commander. But I really like the idea of getting the info. from the source. Plus supporting an independent business. And thanks everyone, I appreciate the input.
But with Jamies help you can easily in 10 minutes or less load a custom MAP that will improve your performance. Then if you use a device like the Power Vison you can data log and self tune with the use of your PC to get virtually the same outcome as a dyno tune.
Call them and ask some questions.