2012 103 pinging HD solution
Advanced
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 72
Likes: 0
From: S.E GA
I have the same going on with a 96 2010 SG same rpm.I am running a power vision by dynojet.I have reset 80 % of the VE and retarded the timeing as much as 11.82 deg in the @ 3000 ram and still have knock. Here are is timing for the front cylinder the rear is fine my cylinder head temp runs 230 to 247. Here is timing I have removed. And I am still getting knock from .05 deg to 3.00.
0.00 1.50 0.00 0.00 2.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 (2000 rpm
2.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 (2250 rpm
1.10 5.50 1.50 1.50 0.00 1.34 2.00 0.00 1.29 1.75 (2500 rpm
10.75 2.00 2.00 3.50 5.80 3.92 4.94 3.43 0.00 2.93 (2750 rpm
4.50 2.50 4.00 2.58 3.81 11.82 10.15 8.63 9.95 8.52 (3000 rpm
8.08 0.00 0.00 2.00 4.33 4.62 7.23 6.79 8.36 7.73 (3500 rpm
0.00 2.50 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 3.39 5.10 (4000 rpm
0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 2.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 (4500 rpm
Good luck with your ping Bill
0.00 1.50 0.00 0.00 2.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 (2000 rpm
2.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 (2250 rpm
1.10 5.50 1.50 1.50 0.00 1.34 2.00 0.00 1.29 1.75 (2500 rpm
10.75 2.00 2.00 3.50 5.80 3.92 4.94 3.43 0.00 2.93 (2750 rpm
4.50 2.50 4.00 2.58 3.81 11.82 10.15 8.63 9.95 8.52 (3000 rpm
8.08 0.00 0.00 2.00 4.33 4.62 7.23 6.79 8.36 7.73 (3500 rpm
0.00 2.50 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 3.39 5.10 (4000 rpm
0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 2.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 (4500 rpm
Good luck with your ping Bill
Road Warrior
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,889
Likes: 104
From: Mississippi
I have had my bike into the local Harley dealer for the dreaded pinging. It went in a couple of weeks ago and all they did was mist some water in the intake to eliminate the carbon build up. It sounded better for a week or so. I am still having issues with it so I called my dealer again and he talked to HD and they want the dealer to send the ECM unit back to them. They said they will have it for a day and send it back. Not really sure what they are going to do. Dealer said HD knows they have a problem and still trying to find the fix for it. The dealer said they may hook up a tuner to it to solve the issue. I hope this solves this once and for all.
Road Captain
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 552
Likes: 2
From: Florida
been hearing tales about a new flash download for the 103, to help with the ping, just wondering if your new ECM has that flash on it. now that it's gone.
Intermediate
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 47
Likes: 1
From: Texas
Wondering same thing... Mine solved with another tune but not from HD.
Road Warrior
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,949
Likes: 288
I fixed mine by fine tuning with my PowerVision. I was getting ping under load, and actually used a combination of retard timing/a little additional fuel. You can see my set-up in sig line. Took a couple of iterations, but a dual approach is necessary, imo. Good luck.
TedMan
TedMan
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,306
Likes: 39
From: Everywhere
Did your dealer check that the ecm was "current" with updates? My bike is at my dealer once a year for a 10k (I trust my dealer and got 5 10k service coupons with purchase along with 1k service coupon so it don't cost anything). Each time I bring it in, Serv Mgr says "he checked to see if your ecm is current". Twice, he followed it by saying "you didn't have the most current update so he downloaded it"
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,007
Likes: 353
From: Ohio
I have the same going on with a 96 2010 SG same rpm.I am running a power vision by dynojet.I have reset 80 % of the VE and retarded the timeing as much as 11.82 deg in the @ 3000 ram and still have knock. Here are is timing for the front cylinder the rear is fine my cylinder head temp runs 230 to 247. Here is timing I have removed. And I am still getting knock from .05 deg to 3.00.
0.00 1.50 0.00 0.00 2.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 (2000 rpm
2.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 (2250 rpm
1.10 5.50 1.50 1.50 0.00 1.34 2.00 0.00 1.29 1.75 (2500 rpm
10.75 2.00 2.00 3.50 5.80 3.92 4.94 3.43 0.00 2.93 (2750 rpm
4.50 2.50 4.00 2.58 3.81 11.82 10.15 8.63 9.95 8.52 (3000 rpm
8.08 0.00 0.00 2.00 4.33 4.62 7.23 6.79 8.36 7.73 (3500 rpm
0.00 2.50 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 3.39 5.10 (4000 rpm
0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 2.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 (4500 rpm
Good luck with your ping Bill
0.00 1.50 0.00 0.00 2.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 (2000 rpm
2.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 (2250 rpm
1.10 5.50 1.50 1.50 0.00 1.34 2.00 0.00 1.29 1.75 (2500 rpm
10.75 2.00 2.00 3.50 5.80 3.92 4.94 3.43 0.00 2.93 (2750 rpm
4.50 2.50 4.00 2.58 3.81 11.82 10.15 8.63 9.95 8.52 (3000 rpm
8.08 0.00 0.00 2.00 4.33 4.62 7.23 6.79 8.36 7.73 (3500 rpm
0.00 2.50 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 3.39 5.10 (4000 rpm
0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 2.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 (4500 rpm
Good luck with your ping Bill
Elite HDF Member
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 3,846
Likes: 173
From: Simi Valley, CA
I fixed mine by fine tuning with my PowerVision. I was getting ping under load, and actually used a combination of retard timing/a little additional fuel. You can see my set-up in sig line. Took a couple of iterations, but a dual approach is necessary, imo. Good luck.
TedMan
TedMan
Most of the HD EFI pinging is due to high heat and a very lean AFR, not timing. Stock calibrations are very lean. That causes a lot of engine heat. And high heat interfers with the combustion pattern in the chamber. This results in detonation (aka pinging). Retarding the spark will not eliminate it. The only way to fix it is to richen the mixture in the table ranges where the pinging happens. This reduces the heat and evens out the flame front in the chamber. Not sure how to do this with power vision.
Did your dealer check that the ecm was "current" with updates? My bike is at my dealer once a year for a 10k (I trust my dealer and got 5 10k service coupons with purchase along with 1k service coupon so it don't cost anything). Each time I bring it in, Serv Mgr says "he checked to see if your ecm is current". Twice, he followed it by saying "you didn't have the most current update so he downloaded it"
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Stellar HDF Member
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,275
Likes: 241
From: Highlands, NJ
Getting my bike Dynoed by a reputable tuner, was the best $400 I ever spent on it. Not one single ping or decel pop. Bike pulls like a mule, and accelerates like a jackrabbit. You'll probably spend a shitload more on chrome, so breakdown and get it tuned properly.
BTW, whenever I bring it in for warranty issues, I tell them not to mess with the ECM.
BTW, whenever I bring it in for warranty issues, I tell them not to mess with the ECM.
Banned
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,119
Likes: 651
From: null
I have, as referenced above, adding xieds, which result in a richer mixture.
pre-ignition can be caused by one or more of the following:
lean mixture
too advanced ignition timing
too high combustion chamber heat
low fuel octane
high compression ( diesel type ignition due to compression)
depending on the vehicle, the ecm may retard spark timing in an attempt to reduce pinging, this retarded timing will probably reduce power and will reduce mpg.
if pinging is reduced by richening the mixture, then the spark timing will remain "advanced" and better power and fuel efficiency will be achieved.
Mike
pre-ignition can be caused by one or more of the following:
lean mixture
too advanced ignition timing
too high combustion chamber heat
low fuel octane
high compression ( diesel type ignition due to compression)
depending on the vehicle, the ecm may retard spark timing in an attempt to reduce pinging, this retarded timing will probably reduce power and will reduce mpg.
if pinging is reduced by richening the mixture, then the spark timing will remain "advanced" and better power and fuel efficiency will be achieved.
Mike