Ultima 107" motor on a 90 model Bagger
Tourer
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 266
Likes: 0
From: Maine
RE: Ultima 107" motor on a 90 model Bagger
Paco,
What was the temps yesterday? How was the air in the Dyno? Air can make all the difference in the world. Local Harley Dealership here had a dyno shootout and some of the big motors were really putting out some crappy numbers. Air was heavy from exhaust and needed to be a lot cooler. I bet when you take the 90 to have it dyno tuned, it will give you some much better numbers. I have read that Ultima over rates their motors horsepower. The torque is closer on them than hp and you want more torque anyway.
What was the temps yesterday? How was the air in the Dyno? Air can make all the difference in the world. Local Harley Dealership here had a dyno shootout and some of the big motors were really putting out some crappy numbers. Air was heavy from exhaust and needed to be a lot cooler. I bet when you take the 90 to have it dyno tuned, it will give you some much better numbers. I have read that Ultima over rates their motors horsepower. The torque is closer on them than hp and you want more torque anyway.
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Tourer
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 285
Likes: 2
From:
RE: Ultima 107" motor on a 90 model Bagger
Storm 4 U,
I totally agree with you. I wasn't expecting 115 hp, but i was expecting 90-100. Like I said this was Teresi Dyno Drags machine. A big semi with two dynos set up like a drag race. There weren't any real high numbers yesterday. There weren't but 2 -3 bikesover 100hp that i saw. There was a V-rod that didn't make but 81 hp, so go figure.
Goat,
temps were in the high 70's, scattered thunder storms. I had to wait for the truck platform to dry off before i could do my run. you are right about the torque. that's pretty much all i am interested in.
later..........................
I totally agree with you. I wasn't expecting 115 hp, but i was expecting 90-100. Like I said this was Teresi Dyno Drags machine. A big semi with two dynos set up like a drag race. There weren't any real high numbers yesterday. There weren't but 2 -3 bikesover 100hp that i saw. There was a V-rod that didn't make but 81 hp, so go figure.
Goat,
temps were in the high 70's, scattered thunder storms. I had to wait for the truck platform to dry off before i could do my run. you are right about the torque. that's pretty much all i am interested in.
later..........................
6th Gear
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 14
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From:
RE: Ultima 107" motor on a 90 model Bagger
The Goat: I unpacked my first 127" and dropped in with no problems went through all the prechecks and primed the oiling system. Tried to start it and she sounded funny and did not want to continue to run. After only a couple of tries I double checked the wiring on my new single fire coil...everything was good. I then decided to check the compression on and found that I had 150 on the back and Zero on the front cylinder. Checked for any stuck valves and looked at the push rods and found no problems. However Idid look into the cylinder and founda whole lot of detonation holes on the top of the front piston. Strange since I only turned over the engine a few times. I called the dealer who sold me the motor who inturn called the CEO of Ulitma no questions asked I had the 2nd new motor within a week. Put this one in started it up and it works fine. I have 300 miles on motor with no problems.
I seemed to me that the 1st motor I recievedwas not new although it looked it. Cylinder walls looked like mirrors (usually look like this after breakin)and I have never seen a motor with 150psibefore it haseven fired.I pressure checked the 2nd motorbefore I started it for the 1st time and I waspushing80psi on the front and back. Ifigure after breaking I will be running around150psi.Iquess that is why Irecieved a new motor asap with no questions asked :-)
My oil pressure is around 40psi cruising cold and drops to about 20-20 cruising when hot.
I seemed to me that the 1st motor I recievedwas not new although it looked it. Cylinder walls looked like mirrors (usually look like this after breakin)and I have never seen a motor with 150psibefore it haseven fired.I pressure checked the 2nd motorbefore I started it for the 1st time and I waspushing80psi on the front and back. Ifigure after breaking I will be running around150psi.Iquess that is why Irecieved a new motor asap with no questions asked :-)
My oil pressure is around 40psi cruising cold and drops to about 20-20 cruising when hot.
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Tourer
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 285
Likes: 2
From:
RE: Ultima 107" motor on a 90 model Bagger
Goat,
A little more info on the VOE and my inner primary leak from Hotroadking. He has had a lot of experience with the Midwest motors and has a lot of contact with different builders and with Ultima techs. heres what he said:
We had a ton of issues with cyl fit, heat etc with the Midwest 113, spent quite a while having the same discussions on VOES with Bill at Bishops, we talked about it but after talking with John and the Midwest tech warranty reps they both said to never run the VOES.
Also Midwest went to a non programmable ignition on the newer elbrutos to keep the timing pulled back and not allow changing. Just be very careful if you time the motor or let a dyno operator tune it, they'll advance the curve and give you 5 more HP but it's at the expense of the lift of the motor. So stay a little behind in the timing.
As to Inner primarys, if you're getting the leak, I'd advise you to buy a Zippers High performance inner primary bearing. It eliminates the inner race, this race can walk with high performance motors, if it walks in to the primary it cuts the seal, if it walks out it can go into the tranny seal and cause problems.
the High tq bearing eliminates the inner race, you pull it off the mainshaft and run the new bearing, much better setup.[/align][/align]Hope this sheds a little light on the situation of the VOE .[/align][/align]later...........................[/align][/align][/align]
A little more info on the VOE and my inner primary leak from Hotroadking. He has had a lot of experience with the Midwest motors and has a lot of contact with different builders and with Ultima techs. heres what he said:
We had a ton of issues with cyl fit, heat etc with the Midwest 113, spent quite a while having the same discussions on VOES with Bill at Bishops, we talked about it but after talking with John and the Midwest tech warranty reps they both said to never run the VOES.
Also Midwest went to a non programmable ignition on the newer elbrutos to keep the timing pulled back and not allow changing. Just be very careful if you time the motor or let a dyno operator tune it, they'll advance the curve and give you 5 more HP but it's at the expense of the lift of the motor. So stay a little behind in the timing.
As to Inner primarys, if you're getting the leak, I'd advise you to buy a Zippers High performance inner primary bearing. It eliminates the inner race, this race can walk with high performance motors, if it walks in to the primary it cuts the seal, if it walks out it can go into the tranny seal and cause problems.
the High tq bearing eliminates the inner race, you pull it off the mainshaft and run the new bearing, much better setup.[/align][/align]Hope this sheds a little light on the situation of the VOE .[/align][/align]later...........................[/align][/align][/align]
Tourer
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 266
Likes: 0
From: Maine
RE: Ultima 107" motor on a 90 model Bagger
Shed's a lot of light on the subject. Thanks for all the info Paco!! It is really appreciated.
Voes is off and I will keep an eye on the inner primary.
Voes is off and I will keep an eye on the inner primary.
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6th Gear
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 12
Likes: 0
From:
RE: Ultima 107" motor on a 90 model Bagger
Howdy
Well i was thinking about getting the Ultima 113 but after reading these postings i'm not sure now.
I check the prices on Ultima's site, what i don't understand is why are all the engines the same price..
Complete 100 CI Engine, Black Finish ... $4,295.00
Complete 113 CI Engine, Black Finish ... $4,295.00
Complete 120 CI Engine, Black Finish ... $4,295.00
Complete 127 CI Engine, Black Finish ... $4,295.00
I've alway thought that if something new comes out that's alittle biger than the last, the price is also alittle biger, that's the American way.. lol
Paco is that the price you payed for your 107 ?
Well i was thinking about getting the Ultima 113 but after reading these postings i'm not sure now.
I check the prices on Ultima's site, what i don't understand is why are all the engines the same price..
Complete 100 CI Engine, Black Finish ... $4,295.00
Complete 113 CI Engine, Black Finish ... $4,295.00
Complete 120 CI Engine, Black Finish ... $4,295.00
Complete 127 CI Engine, Black Finish ... $4,295.00
I've alway thought that if something new comes out that's alittle biger than the last, the price is also alittle biger, that's the American way.. lol
Paco is that the price you payed for your 107 ?
Intermediate
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 33
Likes: 0
From: Rowlett, Texas ( Dallas)
RE: Ultima 107" motor on a 90 model Bagger
Did you have to cut the oem pushrods out ? If these pushrods quiet the engine , please let me know. I will invest in a set for my bike. Do these engines have roller rockers or are they the stock type that come in OEM engines ? thanks JJB1
Paco:
No I didnt have to cut them out...I did have to pull the lifter blocks at the same time as I was trying to get to the lifters...the new ones I should have byWenesday...I already installed my lifetrs back including the new one sent by Ultima wich was a Crane hp the other ones I tested and they seemed ok so I put them back in...with the new pushrods I have any more issues i can take them out in 10 minutes or less and let Ultima keep sending me Cranes lol...but i should be fine now just have to to the TDC thing and get back on the road...
89classic
I would check Jireh the are a little cheaper on the price and it includes shipping...you know on these sites youmostly hear about issues because people need help / vent/ whatever...I did a lot of research and there are a ton of Happy ultima owners out there...I hjave had the belt drive and 6 speed with no issues before I got the motor...Iam a huge EVO fan but once I twisted on the Ultima I dont think I could ever go back...they do have an excellent warranty and have helped me out with anything I wanted to do...I just had a bad lifter and it happens especially on new stuff..again once you fire it up hear the cam and twist on the throttle a little I think for the money and warranty I would still get another no question ...good luck
Paco:
No I didnt have to cut them out...I did have to pull the lifter blocks at the same time as I was trying to get to the lifters...the new ones I should have byWenesday...I already installed my lifetrs back including the new one sent by Ultima wich was a Crane hp the other ones I tested and they seemed ok so I put them back in...with the new pushrods I have any more issues i can take them out in 10 minutes or less and let Ultima keep sending me Cranes lol...but i should be fine now just have to to the TDC thing and get back on the road...
89classic
I would check Jireh the are a little cheaper on the price and it includes shipping...you know on these sites youmostly hear about issues because people need help / vent/ whatever...I did a lot of research and there are a ton of Happy ultima owners out there...I hjave had the belt drive and 6 speed with no issues before I got the motor...Iam a huge EVO fan but once I twisted on the Ultima I dont think I could ever go back...they do have an excellent warranty and have helped me out with anything I wanted to do...I just had a bad lifter and it happens especially on new stuff..again once you fire it up hear the cam and twist on the throttle a little I think for the money and warranty I would still get another no question ...good luck