Power Vision Information Thread
Cruiser
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 220
Likes: 4
From: Orlando
You load that custom "map"/.pvt file into your ECM as a starting point. Then you do a series of Autotunes, to "dial in" your individual bike's VEs. After you run the first AT, save it to your PC and you can do a "Compare" on it, to the initial custom tune you got from the vendor. Some of the cells will be slightly or even siginficantly different. First bring up the original custom tune and then use >Compare>Load Compare the new Autotune you just created with the PV and saved to the PC. Then make sure you go to >Compare>Show Delta as Percent.
The you can click back and forth between the two files and in the "Compare File" which is your Auto Tune number 1, you will see the percent differences from the first.
So then go back to the PV, put it on the bike, load the new Autotune, and go out and run another Autotune and save that one. Then go through the same compare exercise as above. You will now see some probably new small percentage changes on some cells. Save that AT on the PC but also go back out and do it again. Keep doing this iteratively until all cells show less that 5% changes from the previous tune to this tune.
The you can click back and forth between the two files and in the "Compare File" which is your Auto Tune number 1, you will see the percent differences from the first.
So then go back to the PV, put it on the bike, load the new Autotune, and go out and run another Autotune and save that one. Then go through the same compare exercise as above. You will now see some probably new small percentage changes on some cells. Save that AT on the PC but also go back out and do it again. Keep doing this iteratively until all cells show less that 5% changes from the previous tune to this tune.
Here is my question:
Should I just save over the top of the tune every time or create a separate file on the power vision every time I do it? I plan on doing about 4-5, 20 minute runs today with the hopes that I will be down to where I need to be. I think that to properly see the difference I will probably have to go for a ride, come back inside, load it on the computer, see the percentage difference, save it and go create another file.
The couple of tunes I've done so far seem to be working pretty well. Bike runs good, just still a little hot. Plus I'm OCD and want it perfect.
Thanks for the valuable info.
Last edited by jimfount00; Nov 16, 2015 at 10:21 AM.
I've been doing a few autotunes on the "dyno" that I had done here and I'm noticing 20-30% differences in the VE table. I'm going to continue to autotune until I'm 5% or below. Also, not sure how to drop it down to 103 ci where it should be since now it reads 132 ci. I tried to change it on the tune and then when I started the bike it wouldn't idle well and eventually stalled out.
Here is my question:
Should I just save over the top of the tune every time or create a separate file on the power vision every time I do it? I plan on doing about 4-5, 20 minute runs today with the hopes that I will be down to where I need to be. I think that to properly see the difference I will probably have to go for a ride, come back inside, load it on the computer, see the percentage difference, save it and go create another file.
The couple of tunes I've done so far seem to be working pretty well. Bike runs good, just still a little hot. Plus I'm OCD and want it perfect.
Thanks for the valuable info.
Here is my question:
Should I just save over the top of the tune every time or create a separate file on the power vision every time I do it? I plan on doing about 4-5, 20 minute runs today with the hopes that I will be down to where I need to be. I think that to properly see the difference I will probably have to go for a ride, come back inside, load it on the computer, see the percentage difference, save it and go create another file.
The couple of tunes I've done so far seem to be working pretty well. Bike runs good, just still a little hot. Plus I'm OCD and want it perfect.
Thanks for the valuable info.
__________________
Jamie Long / Fuel Moto USA
The USA's Leader V-Twin EFI & Performance www.fuelmotousa.com
Contact 920-423-3309
Email jamie@fuelmotousa.com
Jamie Long / Fuel Moto USA
The USA's Leader V-Twin EFI & Performance www.fuelmotousa.com
Contact 920-423-3309
Email jamie@fuelmotousa.com
Cruiser
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 220
Likes: 4
From: Orlando
I just responded to your email with a revised calibration and instructions. When they did your tune they scaled the displacement excessively, however they did not make changes anywhere else in the map (with the exception of some insignificant edits to the AF and spark tables), at this point I believe we are better starting off fresh with the new map I provided. I also requested some datalogs and noted the channels I need to see in the email as well.
Thanks again. I hope this all works out and I keep my hp and tq! Gaining a little would be a bonus.
Stellar HDF Member
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,928
Likes: 117
From: Ashby, Ma
I've been doing a few autotunes on the "dyno" that I had done here and I'm noticing 20-30% differences in the VE table. I'm going to continue to autotune until I'm 5% or below. Also, not sure how to drop it down to 103 ci where it should be since now it reads 132 ci. I tried to change it on the tune and then when I started the bike it wouldn't idle well and eventually stalled out.
Here is my question:
Should I just save over the top of the tune every time or create a separate file on the power vision every time I do it? I plan on doing about 4-5, 20 minute runs today with the hopes that I will be down to where I need to be. I think that to properly see the difference I will probably have to go for a ride, come back inside, load it on the computer, see the percentage difference, save it and go create another file.
The couple of tunes I've done so far seem to be working pretty well. Bike runs good, just still a little hot. Plus I'm OCD and want it perfect.
Thanks for the valuable info.
Here is my question:
Should I just save over the top of the tune every time or create a separate file on the power vision every time I do it? I plan on doing about 4-5, 20 minute runs today with the hopes that I will be down to where I need to be. I think that to properly see the difference I will probably have to go for a ride, come back inside, load it on the computer, see the percentage difference, save it and go create another file.
The couple of tunes I've done so far seem to be working pretty well. Bike runs good, just still a little hot. Plus I'm OCD and want it perfect.
Thanks for the valuable info.
I'm not really sure that ever paid off for me, but I just thought it made sense and I think I took that suggestion from an "old timer" here at the time.
Road Captain
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 716
Likes: 10
From: Shreveport,La
There are numerous slots on the PV to use to save tunes to when you are doing Autotunes. In general I always liked to save the tunes I was doing, and not write over a tune, until I had savd it to my PC. I just liked being able to keep "tune trail" of how I got to a point.
I'm not really sure that ever paid off for me, but I just thought it made sense and I think I took that suggestion from an "old timer" here at the time.
I'm not really sure that ever paid off for me, but I just thought it made sense and I think I took that suggestion from an "old timer" here at the time.
I may be being a little **** when it comes to this, but out of three bikes I have used the PV on I have never had Jamie to make a VE change to my final tune after I thought I was done. Except for the below 30 kpa on my current 2015 Limited.
Also for those that worry about the life of their PV, I have been using the same one full time on two bikes. Handle bar mounted on every ride so I can monitor gauges. It has almost 100,000 miles on it now. Other than the hood on the mount having the chrome come off and then breaking off itself and the black paint on the face of the PV coming off in places, I have not had one problem with my PV. It has and still works flawlessly. It is going on 6 years old too. It has gone through rain, sleet, hail, and snow, not to mention 100+ to 20+ degrees in temperatures.
Last edited by Watchfuliz; Nov 18, 2015 at 10:42 AM.
Cruiser
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 220
Likes: 4
From: Orlando
There are numerous slots on the PV to use to save tunes to when you are doing Autotunes. In general I always liked to save the tunes I was doing, and not write over a tune, until I had savd it to my PC. I just liked being able to keep "tune trail" of how I got to a point.
I'm not really sure that ever paid off for me, but I just thought it made sense and I think I took that suggestion from an "old timer" here at the time.
I'm not really sure that ever paid off for me, but I just thought it made sense and I think I took that suggestion from an "old timer" here at the time.
I think I'm good now. I'm down below 5% on each cell that I hit. Some rides I would hit cells I didn't hit before and that would make me mad...Jamie actually had me change the auto tune to only go up to 70KPa and not below 35 since I'm really only tuning the closed loop narrow band area.
Nobody better in the customer service "Harley" business than I've seen. Very impressed with the support from Fuel Moto.
Cruiser
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 220
Likes: 4
From: Orlando
I do the same thing. Starting tune in slot 1 and each AT saved in order starting in slot 2. I only do it so I can compare the changes from one to the other. It helps when you have a wild change in a few cells to see if those cells were missed in previous AT runs. I have found <5% change on my "final" AT run with the exception of a 2-3 cells only to go back and find I missed those cells in some of the earlier AT runs causing a large change in my final map. I even have used the snipping tool tool in windows to take screen shots of each VE table and printed them out for an easy compare on paper that I could highlight changes with a marker.
I may be being a little **** when it comes to this, but out of three bikes I have used the PV on I have never had Jamie to make a VE change to my final tune after I thought I was done. Except for the below 30 kpa on my current 2015 Limited.
Also for those that worry about the life of their PV, I have been using the same one full time on two bikes. Handle bar mounted on every ride so I can monitor gauges. It has almost 100,000 miles on it now. Other than the hood on the mount having the chrome come off and then breaking off itself and the black paint on the face of the PV coming off in places, I have not had one problem with my PV. It has and still works flawlessly. It is going on 6 years old too. It has gone through rain, sleet, hail, and snow, not to mention 100+ to 20+ degrees in temperatures.
I may be being a little **** when it comes to this, but out of three bikes I have used the PV on I have never had Jamie to make a VE change to my final tune after I thought I was done. Except for the below 30 kpa on my current 2015 Limited.
Also for those that worry about the life of their PV, I have been using the same one full time on two bikes. Handle bar mounted on every ride so I can monitor gauges. It has almost 100,000 miles on it now. Other than the hood on the mount having the chrome come off and then breaking off itself and the black paint on the face of the PV coming off in places, I have not had one problem with my PV. It has and still works flawlessly. It is going on 6 years old too. It has gone through rain, sleet, hail, and snow, not to mention 100+ to 20+ degrees in temperatures.
Jamie did a great job walking me through a lot of questions. I'm very OCD as well when it comes to this type of stuff. I want the best...not "good enough".
Stellar HDF Member
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,928
Likes: 117
From: Ashby, Ma
I have all the tunes saved as well to see the differences. Just checking to see if it would make more sense or go quicker.
I think I'm good now. I'm down below 5% on each cell that I hit. Some rides I would hit cells I didn't hit before and that would make me mad...Jamie actually had me change the auto tune to only go up to 70KPa and not below 35 since I'm really only tuning the closed loop narrow band area.
Nobody better in the customer service "Harley" business than I've seen. Very impressed with the support from Fuel Moto.
I think I'm good now. I'm down below 5% on each cell that I hit. Some rides I would hit cells I didn't hit before and that would make me mad...Jamie actually had me change the auto tune to only go up to 70KPa and not below 35 since I'm really only tuning the closed loop narrow band area.
Nobody better in the customer service "Harley" business than I've seen. Very impressed with the support from Fuel Moto.
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Cruiser
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 101
Likes: 2
From: Columbus, Ohio, USA
Log Tuner
I had a few questions about log tuner.. and My Tuner...
Are they really that good at getting the most out of your tune? Which one is better?
I have tried a lot of different methods, but I am curious about something. What I read here over and over again is "get the VE's dialed in first!" Then got to timing and AFR. Well how do you know where to start. How much timing to add.. where... what AFR and where.. I have a great person helping me, but I am learning to tweak this myself now and want to try to get a better understanding. I am trying to get lots of power on the bottom end (2000-4000rpms) and good temp management with nice fuel eco in the cruising ranges.
Log tuner:
I AT'ed until I see less than 5% change, and lots and lots of coverage on the map (hits). Adjusted the AFR where I thought was a good start, and then adjusted timing as well. Took a ride and logged. Loaded all the info into LT and I am not sure what to do with what it says... For one, it shows NO corrections needed for VE and only a very few spark knocks. When I apply tune and save changes, and then import. The import doesnt change anything. I did my log run with CL disabled and in OL only. I am wondering if thats why it shows no 100 AFF and 100 CLI through entire Log. In the logs I see very small variations between VE and NEW VE as well.
My tuner:
Cant use it, for whatever reason, when I try to buy it, the webpage crashes and I am unable to do so. I tried this on more than one PC.. I gave up...
I digress..
Ideas?
Glen
Are they really that good at getting the most out of your tune? Which one is better?
I have tried a lot of different methods, but I am curious about something. What I read here over and over again is "get the VE's dialed in first!" Then got to timing and AFR. Well how do you know where to start. How much timing to add.. where... what AFR and where.. I have a great person helping me, but I am learning to tweak this myself now and want to try to get a better understanding. I am trying to get lots of power on the bottom end (2000-4000rpms) and good temp management with nice fuel eco in the cruising ranges.
Log tuner:
I AT'ed until I see less than 5% change, and lots and lots of coverage on the map (hits). Adjusted the AFR where I thought was a good start, and then adjusted timing as well. Took a ride and logged. Loaded all the info into LT and I am not sure what to do with what it says... For one, it shows NO corrections needed for VE and only a very few spark knocks. When I apply tune and save changes, and then import. The import doesnt change anything. I did my log run with CL disabled and in OL only. I am wondering if thats why it shows no 100 AFF and 100 CLI through entire Log. In the logs I see very small variations between VE and NEW VE as well.
My tuner:
Cant use it, for whatever reason, when I try to buy it, the webpage crashes and I am unable to do so. I tried this on more than one PC.. I gave up...
I digress..
Ideas?
Glen
Last edited by adkg12; Nov 20, 2015 at 10:26 AM.
