Installing Torque Cones Question
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Outstanding HDF Member
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From: D.C.
Bike does run better with torque cones. Of course, the dealer tried to sell me another set of pipes last night when I went to pick up the gaskets!
I only rode one day without gaskets and picked up a set of SE ones last night. Put them on really easy and now I feel much better.
Bike does run better with torque cones. Of course, the dealer tried to sell me another set of pipes last night when I went to pick up the gaskets!
Bike does run better with torque cones. Of course, the dealer tried to sell me another set of pipes last night when I went to pick up the gaskets!
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DKCustomProducts.com
DKCustomProducts.com
Thread Starter
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Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Apr 2009
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From: D.C.
Hey Voony, if you can feel the difference with torque cones, you will Really notice a difference with the Thunder Torque Inserts. Give em a try.
W118's is what will fit your drag pipes.
http://www.dkcustomproducts.com/Thun...DK-TTI-118.htm
- High-Temp Powder Coat Finish
- Stainless Steel Studs (5/16" diameter)
- Includes All Hardware
- FITS 1.5" diameter & larger Slip-ons (other sizes available)
- Increases Low & Mid Range Torque
- Increased Exhaust Gas Velocity
- Increased Inertial Scavenging
- Adjustable Sound Volume & Tone
- E-Z Installation Bolts into the end of the slip-on muffler (using the baffle bolt hole)
- Made in The USA!
How do Thunder Torque Inserts Produce So Much Power?
Short Answer:
The Thunder Torque Inserts have a proprietary shape that is much better at increasing exhaust gas velocity, thereby reducing reversion, which reduces engine pumping losses, and increasing inertial scavenging. Net result is a significant increase in power & torque in the low and mid range Without sacrificing any top end.
Long Answer:
Here's a bit of info that is relevant to the Thunder Torques that might be interesting to some.
The type of material, shape, size, thickness, & surface coatings all make a difference in how well the Thunder Torque works at increasing exhaust gas velocity.
The TTI's obviously have their genesis in the simple lollipop concept. But they are quite a bit more, especially the W series.
Technically exhaust systems cannot increase or decrease an engines power. However, and this is a BIG however, exhausts systems can have a profound affect on increasing or decreasing engine pumping loss.
You can loosely compare engine pumping loss with adding an extra 200 lbs weight to the bike. The engine still has the same amount of power, but with the extra weight on the bike it will accelerate slower...it will feel like it has less power than it would if the extra 200 lbs was removed.
Every engine will suffer to some degree from engine pumping loss. The goal of many exhaust systems (including the Thunder Torque Inserts) is reduced engine pumping losses, resulting in more felt power at the rear wheel. If efficiency of the engine increases then fuel mileage may also increase because less throttle is needed to move the bike forward at the same speed.
There are Many design factors that can affect whether an exhaust system increases or decreases engine pumping losses, far more than could be put in a post here (by me anyway lol).
Generally most of us that ride Harley's want the most felt (rear wheel) torque in the low to mid rpm range as possible. Inertial scavenging has a major effect on that felt power.
The nuts & bolts of increasing inertial scavenging is the following-
When the exhaust valve opens two thing happen. A pulse (wave) of energy enters the exhaust pipe, generally at 1300-1700 feet per second. This can be understood as a shock wave from an explosion.
At the same time the spent combustion gases enter the exhaust pipe at 150-300 feet per second. (Generally the faster the exhaust gases travel, the better the inertial scavenging and the less engine pumping loss)
The energy wave that is heading toward the end of the pipe will get to a low pressure area faster (low pressure being a bigger area of the pipe OR the end of the pipe) WHEN that happens some of the wave will reverse direction and collide with the slower moving exhaust gases that are still traveling toward the end of the pipe. This will slow down the speed of the exhaust gases. This will produce the result of less felt torque at the rear wheel.
Exhaust systems that are are successful in increasing exhaust gas velocity (resulting in an increase in inertial scavenging and a decrease in engine pumping loss) will make the bike have more felt torque across the RPM band, especially in the low & mid range.
There is much more to how exhaust systems help or hurt the felt power. But the main goal that is achieved by the unique design and combination of materials in TTI's is to increase felt power in most any exhaust system for a low price.
DK Custom Products has a Utility Patent Pending on the W series of Thunder Torque Inserts.
Thread Starter
|
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 2,705
Likes: 2
From: D.C.
Thunder Torque Inserts
W118's is what will fit your drag pipes.
http://www.dkcustomproducts.com/Thun...DK-TTI-118.htm
How do Thunder Torque Inserts Produce So Much Power?
Short Answer:
The Thunder Torque Inserts have a proprietary shape that is much better at increasing exhaust gas velocity, thereby reducing reversion, which reduces engine pumping losses, and increasing inertial scavenging. Net result is a significant increase in power & torque in the low and mid range Without sacrificing any top end.
Long Answer:
Here's a bit of info that is relevant to the Thunder Torques that might be interesting to some.
The type of material, shape, size, thickness, & surface coatings all make a difference in how well the Thunder Torque works at increasing exhaust gas velocity.
The TTI's obviously have their genesis in the simple lollipop concept. But they are quite a bit more, especially the W series.
Technically exhaust systems cannot increase or decrease an engines power. However, and this is a BIG however, exhausts systems can have a profound affect on increasing or decreasing engine pumping loss.
You can loosely compare engine pumping loss with adding an extra 200 lbs weight to the bike. The engine still has the same amount of power, but with the extra weight on the bike it will accelerate slower...it will feel like it has less power than it would if the extra 200 lbs was removed.
Every engine will suffer to some degree from engine pumping loss. The goal of many exhaust systems (including the Thunder Torque Inserts) is reduced engine pumping losses, resulting in more felt power at the rear wheel. If efficiency of the engine increases then fuel mileage may also increase because less throttle is needed to move the bike forward at the same speed.
There are Many design factors that can affect whether an exhaust system increases or decreases engine pumping losses, far more than could be put in a post here (by me anyway lol).
Generally most of us that ride Harley's want the most felt (rear wheel) torque in the low to mid rpm range as possible. Inertial scavenging has a major effect on that felt power.
The nuts & bolts of increasing inertial scavenging is the following-
When the exhaust valve opens two thing happen. A pulse (wave) of energy enters the exhaust pipe, generally at 1300-1700 feet per second. This can be understood as a shock wave from an explosion.
At the same time the spent combustion gases enter the exhaust pipe at 150-300 feet per second. (Generally the faster the exhaust gases travel, the better the inertial scavenging and the less engine pumping loss)
The energy wave that is heading toward the end of the pipe will get to a low pressure area faster (low pressure being a bigger area of the pipe OR the end of the pipe) WHEN that happens some of the wave will reverse direction and collide with the slower moving exhaust gases that are still traveling toward the end of the pipe. This will slow down the speed of the exhaust gases. This will produce the result of less felt torque at the rear wheel.
Exhaust systems that are are successful in increasing exhaust gas velocity (resulting in an increase in inertial scavenging and a decrease in engine pumping loss) will make the bike have more felt torque across the RPM band, especially in the low & mid range.
There is much more to how exhaust systems help or hurt the felt power. But the main goal that is achieved by the unique design and combination of materials in TTI's is to increase felt power in most any exhaust system for a low price.
DK Custom Products has a Utility Patent Pending on the W series of Thunder Torque Inserts.
W118's is what will fit your drag pipes.
http://www.dkcustomproducts.com/Thun...DK-TTI-118.htm
- High-Temp Powder Coat Finish
- Stainless Steel Studs (5/16" diameter)
- Includes All Hardware
- FITS 1.5" diameter & larger Slip-ons (other sizes available)
- Increases Low & Mid Range Torque
- Increased Exhaust Gas Velocity
- Increased Inertial Scavenging
- Adjustable Sound Volume & Tone
- E-Z Installation Bolts into the end of the slip-on muffler (using the baffle bolt hole)
- Made in The USA!
How do Thunder Torque Inserts Produce So Much Power?
Short Answer:
The Thunder Torque Inserts have a proprietary shape that is much better at increasing exhaust gas velocity, thereby reducing reversion, which reduces engine pumping losses, and increasing inertial scavenging. Net result is a significant increase in power & torque in the low and mid range Without sacrificing any top end.
Long Answer:
Here's a bit of info that is relevant to the Thunder Torques that might be interesting to some.
The type of material, shape, size, thickness, & surface coatings all make a difference in how well the Thunder Torque works at increasing exhaust gas velocity.
The TTI's obviously have their genesis in the simple lollipop concept. But they are quite a bit more, especially the W series.
Technically exhaust systems cannot increase or decrease an engines power. However, and this is a BIG however, exhausts systems can have a profound affect on increasing or decreasing engine pumping loss.
You can loosely compare engine pumping loss with adding an extra 200 lbs weight to the bike. The engine still has the same amount of power, but with the extra weight on the bike it will accelerate slower...it will feel like it has less power than it would if the extra 200 lbs was removed.
Every engine will suffer to some degree from engine pumping loss. The goal of many exhaust systems (including the Thunder Torque Inserts) is reduced engine pumping losses, resulting in more felt power at the rear wheel. If efficiency of the engine increases then fuel mileage may also increase because less throttle is needed to move the bike forward at the same speed.
There are Many design factors that can affect whether an exhaust system increases or decreases engine pumping losses, far more than could be put in a post here (by me anyway lol).
Generally most of us that ride Harley's want the most felt (rear wheel) torque in the low to mid rpm range as possible. Inertial scavenging has a major effect on that felt power.
The nuts & bolts of increasing inertial scavenging is the following-
When the exhaust valve opens two thing happen. A pulse (wave) of energy enters the exhaust pipe, generally at 1300-1700 feet per second. This can be understood as a shock wave from an explosion.
At the same time the spent combustion gases enter the exhaust pipe at 150-300 feet per second. (Generally the faster the exhaust gases travel, the better the inertial scavenging and the less engine pumping loss)
The energy wave that is heading toward the end of the pipe will get to a low pressure area faster (low pressure being a bigger area of the pipe OR the end of the pipe) WHEN that happens some of the wave will reverse direction and collide with the slower moving exhaust gases that are still traveling toward the end of the pipe. This will slow down the speed of the exhaust gases. This will produce the result of less felt torque at the rear wheel.
Exhaust systems that are are successful in increasing exhaust gas velocity (resulting in an increase in inertial scavenging and a decrease in engine pumping loss) will make the bike have more felt torque across the RPM band, especially in the low & mid range.
There is much more to how exhaust systems help or hurt the felt power. But the main goal that is achieved by the unique design and combination of materials in TTI's is to increase felt power in most any exhaust system for a low price.
DK Custom Products has a Utility Patent Pending on the W series of Thunder Torque Inserts.
Sorry I didn't pay attention re: fitting.
We get a lot of questions about the TTI's, and confusion also with torque cones, so I thought I would copy & paste a write up have on them.
Most won't believe it, and the exhaust companies really won't like it, but most any slip-on (or drag pipe) with or without the baffle and the $25 Thunder Torque Insert installed will give more low and mid range torque than any slip-on you can buy.
If you install the W118 Thunder Torques on your drag pies, and run it on the Dyno without the TTI's and then don't change anything else, but install the TTI's and don't get an increase in Torque in the low and mid range, we'll refund your $ for the TTI's.
You can use your butt dyno if you want to save some $...bottom line is we know you will get a noticeable increase in low and mid range power, and if you don't feel it, let us know and we'll refund your $.
Thread Starter
|
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 2,705
Likes: 2
From: D.C.
Voony, no offense taken.
We get a lot of questions about the TTI's, and confusion also with torque cones, so I thought I would copy & paste a write up have on them.
Most won't believe it, and the exhaust companies really won't like it, but most any slip-on (or drag pipe) with or without the baffle and the $25 Thunder Torque Insert installed will give more low and mid range torque than any slip-on you can buy.
If you install the W118 Thunder Torques on your drag pies, and run it on the Dyno without the TTI's and then don't change anything else, but install the TTI's and don't get an increase in Torque in the low and mid range, we'll refund your $ for the TTI's.
You can use your butt dyno if you want to save some $...bottom line is we know you will get a noticeable increase in low and mid range power, and if you don't feel it, let us know and we'll refund your $.
We get a lot of questions about the TTI's, and confusion also with torque cones, so I thought I would copy & paste a write up have on them.
Most won't believe it, and the exhaust companies really won't like it, but most any slip-on (or drag pipe) with or without the baffle and the $25 Thunder Torque Insert installed will give more low and mid range torque than any slip-on you can buy.
If you install the W118 Thunder Torques on your drag pies, and run it on the Dyno without the TTI's and then don't change anything else, but install the TTI's and don't get an increase in Torque in the low and mid range, we'll refund your $ for the TTI's.
You can use your butt dyno if you want to save some $...bottom line is we know you will get a noticeable increase in low and mid range power, and if you don't feel it, let us know and we'll refund your $.
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If not, then drill a hole, 1" to 3" from the end of the pipe and put it in.
I tried attaching the PDF file of instructions to this post, but it would not let me. If you want to PM me with your email addy I can send you the step-by-step instructions.
Thread Starter
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Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 2,705
Likes: 2
From: D.C.
If you have a bolt hole toward the tail end of your pipes, just put it in there. (most have them for holding a baffle in).
If not, then drill a hole, 1" to 3" from the end of the pipe and put it in.
I tried attaching the PDF file of instructions to this post, but it would not let me. If you want to PM me with your email addy I can send you the step-by-step instructions.
If not, then drill a hole, 1" to 3" from the end of the pipe and put it in.
I tried attaching the PDF file of instructions to this post, but it would not let me. If you want to PM me with your email addy I can send you the step-by-step instructions.
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