DYNOJET: Auto tune ?

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Sep 18, 2017 | 11:03 AM

Clayton24

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From: Coal grove ohio 45638

Auto tune ?

I have a 2015 ultra limited with stage 1 plus 57h cams an power vision tuner got a map and bike runs pretty darn good i was trying to figure out if i should run the autotune basic any way to fine tune or leave it alone ? Thanks

Sep 18, 2017 | 11:45 AM

FLTRI17

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As good as you feel it is it'll get better with a few autotune sessions simply because no 2 bikes run the same due to production variation in all the parts that can affect fueling requirements. Remember, what you experience riding your bike is the best you've felt, so if you get it tuned or run successful autotunes you will realize what you have been missing out on...smoothness, responsiveness, acceleration, and great mileage.
It would be a 1 in 10,000 or more if the bike doesn't run noticeably better after tuning your canned map..
Bob

Sep 18, 2017 | 12:55 PM

Clayton24

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From: Coal grove ohio 45638

Quote:

Originally Posted by FLTRI17

ok thank you very helpful info answered perfectley

Sep 18, 2017 | 01:45 PM

strych9

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From: Omaha,NE

Timely question as I am using a canned DynoJet tune for my TAB Performance/K&N setup and was wondering the same thing. I really question whether a narrow band Auto Tune will do much good, as I presume the canned tune is from a dyno tune utilizing a wide-band sensor, i.e. a better tune. Frankly I think variences between bikes are negligible; if mine runs well I will not Auto Tune. Not until I get a header and wideband to dial it in, at least.

Sep 21, 2017 | 10:41 AM

FLTRI17

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Quote:

Originally Posted by strych9

Since most tuners use the OEM sensors to precisely tune all closed loop areas with great results I'm not quite clear as to why there are posts making statements indicating one sensor is more reliable than another.

Consider this:
OEMs use narrow band sensors due their reactive speed.
Broadband sensors are the same sensor as the narrow bands with an added circuit to expand its ability to read to greater extents but lose speed in doing so.
This is not good enough to meet emissions AND best performance goals.

Broadband sensors are great for racing purposes since they allow for much richer AFR due to long durations of high loads and WOT. That said some teams opt to remove the O2 for the race so if a sensor fails it won't affect running.
If, for some reason there is a need to run excessively rich for street running, broadband sensors will be a better choice.
Help?
Bob

Sep 21, 2017 | 03:10 PM

marcodarq

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From: florida

I cant speak for other tuners, but most of the ones that I DO know do NOT depend on narrow band sensors when tuning and neither do I. I own and operate a tuning shop and I am the tuner here. Narrow band sensors do what they were designed for pretty well, but they do not have the scope required for performance tuning and when added engine performance parts have been installed..OEM's use narrow band sensors because of cost concern and they are less money(for the most part) and the bike's control systems are programmed to meet EPA regulations. If you change to many different things with your engine, they can no longer do the required job.. Your idea is kind of backwards. I mean no insult or dis-respect in what i am saying, I'm just trying to put up info that I KNOW to be accurate and based in proven fact.

m

Last edited by marcodarq; Sep 21, 2017 at 03:12 PM.

Sep 22, 2017 | 12:42 PM

hrdtail78

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From: Alorton, Illinois

Depends on what your definition of "performance tuning" is. Mine falls somewhere in the 80kpa area and up. This is the area where narrow bands don't do well but the wide bands do. Now lets look at 60kpa area. This isn't what I consider a "performance" area. This is a light load area and I see no reason not to map VE in this area with narrow bands or why not let narrow bands work in a close loop feedback in this area targeting 14.4. I see a lot of benefits of allowing adaptive to have some control.

Idle? Don't consider this a "performance" area either and what sensor I use is dictated by more things than how the sensor works and more about sample quality. Performance builds usually have performance pipes. These can introduce problems with reversion. Compounding the problem with late closing and overlap cams.

I'll add one thing to Bob's comments on sensors. A WB is still most accurate around lambda 1. Yes it can read farther out, but tolerance of accuracies do go down.

These sensors are what they are and are what we have. I see a place for both in the tuning world. I see people taking about EPA, lean and what not, but rarely do I see people talking about the fuel that we have. We talk about 14.68 as lambda value of 1. 10% ethanol added is still a lambda of 1, but 1 equals 14.13:1 AFR. Since a sensor only puts out a voltage. A sensor voltage of 791mv on gasoline will be 14.34afr, .977lambda but add 10% ethanol and sensor voltage of 791mv will be 13.81, .977 lambda. Still with in the range of heated stock O2's. For older we are looking at .984 lambda, 13.90:1 and O2 voltage of 778.

There are a lot of tools for different jobs. Using the correct tool for the job is still the biggest key.