2017 Milwaukee Eight dyno testing & information
Just an update, I am out of the office this week involved in some collaborative testing on a project that will be hopefully coming to market early 2017. Back at the shop Fuel Moto is running full throttle with testing & calibration development and I will post an update before the weekend. Understand that much of our testing is kept private for obvious reasons, especially on a brand new platform. We put a ton of resources into our R&D program for a company our size and it is something we value & protect greatly.
Also note Dynojet Power Vision for the 2017 Milwaukee Eight will be available Monday 9/26
Also note Dynojet Power Vision for the 2017 Milwaukee Eight will be available Monday 9/26
For those interested. From Dynojet...
http://blogs.dynojet.com/index.php/2...h-ds-have-you/
http://blogs.dynojet.com/index.php/2...h-ds-have-you/
__________________
Jamie Long / Fuel Moto USA
The USA's Leader V-Twin EFI & Performance www.fuelmotousa.com
Contact 920-423-3309
Email jamie@fuelmotousa.com
Jamie Long / Fuel Moto USA
The USA's Leader V-Twin EFI & Performance www.fuelmotousa.com
Contact 920-423-3309
Email jamie@fuelmotousa.com
Banned
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 2,614
Likes: 544
From: Canton Ohio
People call us ,that bought 17's guinee pigs and beta testers. The real ones are the ones that hook the PV up and flash that ECM. Im not gonna feel bad for em when they come on the site bitchin the dealer or HD told em to bad. Mines put away in the box from my 11. Maybe Ill bust it out in a couple years when my warrantys out. Id like to use it ...I got nothin against an improvement....but losing that warranty aint worth it to me. People gripe about the price of these things nowdays...well thats part of that price you paid for the bike...two years covered head to toe exceot expendables...and violating it these days means you paid for it and thew it in trash. Untill we know positively dealer wont know you flashed if you put the stock calibration back in...which nobody in the know thats involved in sellin us these tuners has answered yet that Ive seen....Ill sit back and watch...JMO
Stellar HDF Member
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 2,432
Likes: 290
From: FL
People call us ,that bought 17's guinee pigs and beta testers. The real ones are the ones that hook the PV up and flash that ECM. Im not gonna feel bad for em when they come on the site bitchin the dealer or HD told em to bad. Mines put away in the box from my 11. Maybe Ill bust it out in a couple years when my warrantys out. Id like to use it ...I got nothin against an improvement....but losing that warranty aint worth it to me. People gripe about the price of these things nowdays...well thats part of that price you paid for the bike...two years covered head to toe exceot expendables...and violating it these days means you paid for it and thew it in trash. Untill we know positively dealer wont know you flashed if you put the stock calibration back in...which nobody in the know thats involved in sellin us these tuners has answered yet that Ive seen....Ill sit back and watch...JMO
The Power Vision takes a mirror image of the ECM calibration binary before it marries up to the bike, this can be easily restored at anytime.
Regardless of the tuning product used, the dealer level tools do not have the abilty to read how many times the ECM has been flashed, which calibration, etc..
Regardless of the tuning product used, the dealer level tools do not have the abilty to read how many times the ECM has been flashed, which calibration, etc..
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 17,148
Likes: 6,171
From: SE Michigan
Dealer can see how many times the ECU has been flashed but they cannot see what each previous flash was. They are supposed to keep records annotating this with either dealerspeed or lightspeed software AND their proprietary digital technician software. This was as of six months ago.
The Power Vision takes a mirror image of the ECM calibration binary before it marries up to the bike, this can be easily restored at anytime.
Regardless of the tuning product used, the dealer level tools do not have the abilty to read how many times the ECM has been flashed, which calibration, etc..
Regardless of the tuning product used, the dealer level tools do not have the abilty to read how many times the ECM has been flashed, which calibration, etc..
Last edited by Keithhu; Sep 23, 2016 at 12:18 AM.
Road Captain
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 695
Likes: 50
From: South Carolina
I work in IT. Have been for nearly 15 years. I know a little bit about bits and bytes. It would not take much to include a bit string; ie 00000000, that is incremented each time the ECM is flashed. Any third rate programmer could do it. And if HD was seriously giving way to the EPA, there is no doubt that SOMETHING would/should be there to at least keep track ECM flashes. I used to work in cell phone repair processing/replacing phones under warranty. Of course the warranty does not cover damage caused by water and/or moisture. Can't count the number of times I was told "my phone has never been wet". Well, there is a sticker that is in the battery compartment that turns red if the phone encounters ANY moisture at all. Just a little sticker that went unnoticed placed their by the manufacturer to allow them an out. Many a p!$$ed off individuals had to buy new phones after paying for their "warranties". These tuners have been around for years. It is common knowledge that they have the capability to flash the factory tune back to the bike. I just can't see there NOT being a mechanism incorporated in the programming of the ECM that would indicate that this was done, but what do I know?
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 11,476
Likes: 3,003
From: Charleston, SC
I work in IT. Have been for nearly 15 years. I know a little bit about bits and bytes. It would not take much to include a bit string; ie 00000000, that is incremented each time the ECM is flashed. Any third rate programmer could do it. And if HD was seriously giving way to the EPA, there is no doubt that SOMETHING would/should be there to at least keep track ECM flashes. I used to work in cell phone repair processing/replacing phones under warranty. Of course the warranty does not cover damage caused by water and/or moisture. Can't count the number of times I was told "my phone has never been wet". Well, there is a sticker that is in the battery compartment that turns red if the phone encounters ANY moisture at all. Just a little sticker that went unnoticed placed their by the manufacturer to allow them an out. Many a p!$$ed off individuals had to buy new phones after paying for their "warranties". These tuners have been around for years. It is common knowledge that they have the capability to flash the factory tune back to the bike. I just can't see there NOT being a mechanism incorporated in the programming of the ECM that would indicate that this was done, but what do I know?
On the topic of How it could be done - recording ECM flashes - it could be easily implemented and recorded in non-volatile storage similar to how the ECM presently stores it's S/N etc.
I mean there is obviously an embedded OS stored. It's nothing to store a byte more of information.
So in my opinion, the real question is, if the current ECM does not do this already (secretly) then why? Why does HD Not record it?
In a world where every manufacturer is looking to protect themselves it makes you wonder why they are not doing it with something so simple to implement.
That is...unless...they don't want it stored. To protect themselves and their customers from someone or something else.
Last edited by lp; Sep 23, 2016 at 06:40 AM.
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Who cares if they can tell if/how many times it's been flashed? They are selling the Street Tuner as a EPA compliant and warranty approved device. So if they could tell that it has been flashed who's to say it wasn't flashed with their approved Street Tuner?
Extreme HDF Member
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 14,731
Likes: 2,536
From: Mountain Top, Alabama
The Power Vision takes a mirror image of the ECM calibration binary before it marries up to the bike, this can be easily restored at anytime.
Regardless of the tuning product used, the dealer level tools do not have the abilty to read how many times the ECM has been flashed, which calibration, etc..
Regardless of the tuning product used, the dealer level tools do not have the abilty to read how many times the ECM has been flashed, which calibration, etc..
I'll go along with that.