I don't know if I should place this here, in electrical, or in engine so will post here and move if admin wants it moved.


I have a 2010 ultra classic was a 96. Lost my oil pump andin process of finding out what was wrong realized crank was way out among otherproblems. To rebuild this motor would have been more then I wanted or couldafford to spend. I found a shop that had a rebuilt 103. He told me that thismotor would work fine and will list what motor consist of..

Revolution welded crank trued and balanced
Temkin Bearing left case
Easy start 551 cams
stock oil pump
stock cam plate with fueling spring
new bearings
new lifters
new 1 piece push rods
.005 over Keith black pistons
hasting rings
stock valves
Andrews 600 springs
comp 10.1-1

In the process comp was bad, couldn't get a baker at thetime so installed a Screaming Eagle
Auto chain adjuster replaced for a manual (cant remembername off hand but wasn't a baker)
Added a Variable clutch plate (aim type)

This was all installed by the shop I went to. He has been havinga hard and I mean very hard time getting a tune in this bike. He has got itclose (according to him) and wants me to run it for 1000 miles and then bringit back and he will lean it down some and fine tune it. Got it running fat fornow. He told me stay between 3000 and 4000 rpms. He told me at 2000 to 2500 ishas a "miss" .

Now I want to say I am not asking this and not asking him.For I am talking to him about everything I have to say but would like someinput to make sure I am not being fed a line so here goes.

This thing runs like crap at any rpm range outside of the3000-4000 range. I stay right at the 3000 range and every so often I get a hiccupor miss. But I did notice that if I have my cruse on I don't seem to have anymiss. I only have a little over 200 miles on it so far because I picked it upon sat and shop was over 100 miles from me, he had 60 on it when I picked it upand literally hit two highways to get myself home. He asked me to stay out of6th for now which I don't have a problem with…but on the way home at 3300 rpmsI thought I was in 4th (which I wasn't) and up shifted and I thought the damnbike was gunna toss me off…..started missing and hiccupping that I almostcouldn't get to the shifter fast enough to drop down back to 5th. Anythingbelow 3000 rpms is somewhat scary. I mean I don't have a problem at 3000 but sometimes in a corner I have to rpmdown a little and that gets a little scary also for I get that miss. Right nowI am doing all I can just to get miles on this bike to get it back to him toget it fine tuned. I am giving him the benefit of the doubt for now for part ofthe deal to have him stand behind his work was him do the install and tune. Somy main question at this point is will this ECM from my original 96 handle orwork with the 103? Does some of the problems that I described sound like a normallearning curve with a new motor to get it fined tuned? He told me to keep tankabove 1/2 full because he noticed at 1/4 tank it acted like it was running lowso is going to check the fuel lines (which I had no problem with before) wouldalways run it down to or close to reserve (remaining) light. Bike has only22,640 miles on it.

He does not at this time but in the process of installing adyno machine at this time. He just upgraded to a bigger shop. He has told methat he has countless hours with the manufacturing of the tuning software thathe is using…what he is saying is that I just have "one of thosebikes" that is going to be hard to tune. Being I am not an electricalwizard I am taking him at his word for that…He has done diagnostic oneverything, Stator, regulator/generator, New crank pos sensor, new oil pressuresensor, yada yada yada.. He has "hinted" that he has other bikes withproblems that they had to choose to either replace the ecm or switch it to carbureted…NowI don't know much ecm but I would think going carb would be a big stepbackwards for this bike. I went with a 2010 because price was right, and Ireally liked the ride compared to 2005 or before. Now I have more money intothis bike then it is worth and not correct yet. Hopefully he can get thisfigured out when I take it back but would just like some input from others ifwhat I am saying sounds good or am I being fed a line..

 

I am going to guess that something is not right with that bike, the initial tune should be much closer than that.
Did this guy build that 103?
How did he tune it if he doesn't have a dyno in his shop right now?

You should get some interesting responses to this post

 

OP, you are gonna be getting, more than likely, a bunch of responses, but ya gotta keep in mind that nobody out here on the World Wide Web is gonna have as good a feel for this engine as knowledgeable mechanics who actually can touch and feel that engine, as it runs, and ride it...meaning that if you want a second or third opinion, take the bike to another mechanic and have them diagnose the problem. It will likely cost you some money, since obviously the guy you got it from isn't likely to cover that bill.


You will get a bunch of off the cuff answers from us here, and probably 90% or more will be completely incorrect...and maybe 5-10% might have some validity...but actually correcting the problem is likely gonna involve a teardown of the work that has been done.


I do agree with your guy's statement that this engine is 'just one of those bikes'...yeah, it does happen, but at the end of the day, there's something going on that will be the answer to the problems you are having. Your problem is that you really don't know what that 'rebuilt 103' engine is, and how many engines contributed to the end product, and how exactly it was built.


Are you being 'fed a line'? Who among us are gonna know that? But another trusted mechanic might be able to tell you...that is, IF you can trust him!

 

Thank you both for your response, and I do know that I am opening a can of worms with a broad questions that I posted. As far as the motor he (his shop) did the build. As far as how did he tune it without using a dyno I questioned that before he even took my bike in and he said that he preferred to do a static tune and then tune as he drives it. As I said I don't know that much about the whole process so only could take him for his word. He has a pretty nice shop, lots of lifts and lots of bikes sitting to be worked on so don't think he is a shade tree one bike type mechanic. Like I said he is upgradeing to an even bigger shop at this very moment and addind a dyno so hopefully will have that up and running by the time I take this back to him..


As far an another mechanic that is my plan later this week when I get a free couple minutes. I do have a trusted friend that has been a Harley mechanic for 20 years and has his own shop now. I wanted him to do the install but the builder wouldn't go for that to cover his parts or warentee the motor.

 

Your stock ECM can handle it.
But you did not say what he tuned it with, and what starter map he put in.

Different tuners (tuning devices) have different maps available, and if there are none for that tuner with your exact build it may not run well at all. He has to choose the closest match to your build from the maps available.

You also did not way what type of exhaust, etc. As well as engine parts they play a role in choosing a map.

Hopefully by the time you bring it back he will have his dyno up and running, and knows how to use it.
.

 

Yes this I have thought of too. I didn't say the name of the tunner he used because it slips my mind right now..I want to say dynotune but not positive on that...


I have a stock header that is gutted with rush pipes. Used my big air sucker intake off of my 96. He said he has a base map in it now and said the bike should not even be running with that map in it but every other thing that they have tried didn't work. He even tried a auxillary tunner on it which he prefers not to use and that didn't work either so he went back to just the ecm...as far as all the parts in the motor besides what I listed above he should know and have input all that info since he built the motor.

 

I'm just gonna say if he built it, it runs like crap and he can't get a tune on it, he has no idea what he is doing. He should pay to have a qualified mechanic look at it and/or give ya your money back. Oh and ya shouldn't be riding it around like that!

 

I know you don't want to hear any more bad news, but I would have him take that Frankenstein motor he built, that he can't tune, out of that bike, buy a used 96" or 103" on eBay and have another reputable shop do the install. You have too much going on to try and pinpoint what the problem is. My 2 cents. Hope all goes well, keep us posted.

 

​​​​​​​This is the best move OP can make.

 

I have been running that thru my mind also. Have kept documantaion of everything that we have discussed and said. I am going to give him the chance to get it on the dyno once he has it up and going because that was all part of the deal, I have exhausted all my money on this bike right now so going to let him at least try and get it right first and then go from there. Hopefully I don't have to go the other route because I am sure small claims court would be involved in that and only want to take that route if I have too. As far as a used 96 or 103 I thought real hard about that when this all first happened but I decided that if I did anything I would have a welded crank in it and a temkin bearing at the least.