Rear Stabilizers.....Requesting Input
Road Captain
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 697
Likes: 51
From: Clarington, Ontario
TWR users, does this unit keep the right passenger floorboard in the same spot or does it move it closer or further out?
btw, when looking at the Glide-Pro, I find it a bit excessive that shipping to Canada is $100. I just a Wheeldock EZ-UP shipped to me from the USA for $30 and it is a LOT bigger box.
Dale
btw, when looking at the Glide-Pro, I find it a bit excessive that shipping to Canada is $100. I just a Wheeldock EZ-UP shipped to me from the USA for $30 and it is a LOT bigger box.
Dale
Cruiser
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 117
Likes: 3
From: Milwaukie Oregon
TWR users, does this unit keep the right passenger floorboard in the same spot or does it move it closer or further out?
btw, when looking at the Glide-Pro, I find it a bit excessive that shipping to Canada is $100. I just a Wheeldock EZ-UP shipped to me from the USA for $30 and it is a LOT bigger box.
Dale
btw, when looking at the Glide-Pro, I find it a bit excessive that shipping to Canada is $100. I just a Wheeldock EZ-UP shipped to me from the USA for $30 and it is a LOT bigger box.
Dale
Road Master
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 899
Likes: 2
From:
Tracy's (TWR) price for HD Forum's members includes shipping. As a bonus, he is in Canada and price includes taxes.
Cruiser
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 230
Likes: 0
From: Florida
Let me toss this out for you guys to see how you all digest this.
For the sake of description, I'm going to refer to the side mounting device as Cleve block mounted, and the rival offerings as a Cross member mounted device.
Since we have no physical data, nor Physicist and/or Mechanical Engineer's input thus far WE have no idea how much FORCE of lateral thrust we are dealing with on these sometimes 2-up loaded down behemoths. That in and of itself is enough for physics to contend with, now throw in some long sweepers with varying transition AT 70+ MPH! That, my friends, could exert a lateral force that could prove difficult to reckon with let alone with human lives at stake. Bring on the potential solutions and what we are dealing with most, if not all, of the offerings to date are 2 conceptual designs. Cleve block mount vs. Cross member mount.
Since nobody as of yet can produce numbers of exactly how much FORCE of lateral gyration/torsion we are dealing related to this kinetic cause and effect phenomenon, I'm left to ponder how much STRESS the rear portion of the frame can actually endure.
Now this brings me to the meat of my concern. In terms of SURFACE AREA that these 2 principle offerings adhere to the frame, and since LATERAL movement is what is attempting to be controlled, what device WOULD withstand MORE pressure without undue stress to the components of the device and also to the frame of the motorcycle itself without adverse effects to either now or later?
The Cleve Block is held on PERPENDICULARLY to the side in a rather small surface area. The Cross member device is fastened LONGITUDINALLY over a much greater surface area, as BOTH attempt to subdue the aforementioned forces of kinesiology.
Hmmmm............anybody know exactly how much force the cleve block area of the frame can endure with a device "strapped" to it in an attempt to stop this "wobble" and if so, what kind of data could be presented to validate this area of the motorcycle being able to handle such stress?
I'm no rocket scientist, but I do play one on TV.
Just kidding, but I would like some feedback on these issues.
For the sake of description, I'm going to refer to the side mounting device as Cleve block mounted, and the rival offerings as a Cross member mounted device.
Since we have no physical data, nor Physicist and/or Mechanical Engineer's input thus far WE have no idea how much FORCE of lateral thrust we are dealing with on these sometimes 2-up loaded down behemoths. That in and of itself is enough for physics to contend with, now throw in some long sweepers with varying transition AT 70+ MPH! That, my friends, could exert a lateral force that could prove difficult to reckon with let alone with human lives at stake. Bring on the potential solutions and what we are dealing with most, if not all, of the offerings to date are 2 conceptual designs. Cleve block mount vs. Cross member mount.
Since nobody as of yet can produce numbers of exactly how much FORCE of lateral gyration/torsion we are dealing related to this kinetic cause and effect phenomenon, I'm left to ponder how much STRESS the rear portion of the frame can actually endure.
Now this brings me to the meat of my concern. In terms of SURFACE AREA that these 2 principle offerings adhere to the frame, and since LATERAL movement is what is attempting to be controlled, what device WOULD withstand MORE pressure without undue stress to the components of the device and also to the frame of the motorcycle itself without adverse effects to either now or later?
The Cleve Block is held on PERPENDICULARLY to the side in a rather small surface area. The Cross member device is fastened LONGITUDINALLY over a much greater surface area, as BOTH attempt to subdue the aforementioned forces of kinesiology.
Hmmmm............anybody know exactly how much force the cleve block area of the frame can endure with a device "strapped" to it in an attempt to stop this "wobble" and if so, what kind of data could be presented to validate this area of the motorcycle being able to handle such stress?
I'm no rocket scientist, but I do play one on TV.
Just kidding, but I would like some feedback on these issues.I have a question for you. Can you please tell me your opinion why no motor unit in the country riding HD is installing an after market stabilizer? I am really trying hard to figure this out. I would think that if it's a matter of safety these would be the guys that would really need it more than anyone. Riding day in day out. High speed pursuit, etc. I have never heard from any motorman on the forum that has installed a stabilizer on his personal bike. If there is one I'd love to hear about the details.
Cruiser
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 117
Likes: 3
From: Milwaukie Oregon
No known issues It bolts up just the same and with the same hole config.
Cruiser
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 115
Likes: 0
From: Northwest Arkansas
I too wondered why the motorcops don’t experience the wobble and I’m not sure that they don’t. The guys I know and ride with around here use Road Kings at work so less weight on the bars may also make a difference. However, I have looked the police bikes over pretty closely and they seem to have as much or more weight on them as a “normal” Ultra, but, a lot of it is carried lower in the side bags and also closer to the fender (lower) than in a tour pack and back of the engine/trans/swingarm junction. I played around with the theory of emulating a police bike as best I could by moving weight right off of the top of that joint and could also minimize the wobble to a degree by intentionally loading behind the joint but I could never eliminate it.
I’ve got a friend that is a police motorcycle instructor and also a Rider’s Edge instructor. He has a 08 Ultra as do I but rides a 07 Road King Police at work. I’ve asked him about the wobble and he swears neither of his bike wobble and but mine gyrates like crazy through the sweepers, especially if there are bumps. No clue if he experiences it on his police motor but I have 3 theories on why he doesn’t feel it on his personal bike:
1: He does in fact experience the wobble but he is “used” to it and considers it normal. To my knowledge, he has ridden touring class H/D’s for the past 15 or 20 years so he may think it is normal.
2: He knows how to correctly corner and does it most every time. I noticed when I was EXTREMELY particular about my path of travel and paid very close attention rolling the throttle on at the apex of the corner, I could minimize the wobble but not completely eliminate it.
3: He is BS’ing me and doesn’t want to admit his wobbles also.
I spoke at length to the service manager at the dealership I teach at before I bought the TWR. He showed me on a bike that was torn down in the shop how everything is put together and essentially everything is riding on rubber in the back of the engine/trans/swingarm junction. After looking at the different offerings very closely, the TWR most closely matched the front motor mount set up of the bike and since Tracy is also big contributor to this forum, I chose his product. Is it the best?? I dunno, Does it work?? From my limited experience on the bike (1 ride to the shop for a checkup before the 105th) it feels MUCH more solid. I have a 60+ mph sweeper with a bump in the apex right near my house that I used to be able to hit and get the wobble at will and when I went over it the other day, there was no wobble that I detected.
I personally don’t think any of the braces need to support a whole lot of stress because the design of the frame will only allow the swingarm to move so far. I look at the brace as a way to eliminate the smaller movements which set up the oscillations. FWIW, the TWR brace has quite a bit of surface area where it contacts the frame so if should spread the load fairly evenly by design. Also, if you look at the front motor mount (which is what the TWR essentially is in the rear), there isn’t a whole lot supporting it either.
Anyway, that’s my .02 from my experience…..
I’ve got a friend that is a police motorcycle instructor and also a Rider’s Edge instructor. He has a 08 Ultra as do I but rides a 07 Road King Police at work. I’ve asked him about the wobble and he swears neither of his bike wobble and but mine gyrates like crazy through the sweepers, especially if there are bumps. No clue if he experiences it on his police motor but I have 3 theories on why he doesn’t feel it on his personal bike:
1: He does in fact experience the wobble but he is “used” to it and considers it normal. To my knowledge, he has ridden touring class H/D’s for the past 15 or 20 years so he may think it is normal.
2: He knows how to correctly corner and does it most every time. I noticed when I was EXTREMELY particular about my path of travel and paid very close attention rolling the throttle on at the apex of the corner, I could minimize the wobble but not completely eliminate it.
3: He is BS’ing me and doesn’t want to admit his wobbles also.
I spoke at length to the service manager at the dealership I teach at before I bought the TWR. He showed me on a bike that was torn down in the shop how everything is put together and essentially everything is riding on rubber in the back of the engine/trans/swingarm junction. After looking at the different offerings very closely, the TWR most closely matched the front motor mount set up of the bike and since Tracy is also big contributor to this forum, I chose his product. Is it the best?? I dunno, Does it work?? From my limited experience on the bike (1 ride to the shop for a checkup before the 105th) it feels MUCH more solid. I have a 60+ mph sweeper with a bump in the apex right near my house that I used to be able to hit and get the wobble at will and when I went over it the other day, there was no wobble that I detected.
I personally don’t think any of the braces need to support a whole lot of stress because the design of the frame will only allow the swingarm to move so far. I look at the brace as a way to eliminate the smaller movements which set up the oscillations. FWIW, the TWR brace has quite a bit of surface area where it contacts the frame so if should spread the load fairly evenly by design. Also, if you look at the front motor mount (which is what the TWR essentially is in the rear), there isn’t a whole lot supporting it either.
Anyway, that’s my .02 from my experience…..
Thread Starter
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Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,294
Likes: 33
From: Po-Dunk Looziana
Good feedback Tim, hogdvr, and others. Much appreciated and valid replies.
I too believe every FLH has a bit of wobble under the right conditions, but I'm really not here to debate whether one has it or not. As for the motorcops? I doubt most spend as much time blazing thru long sweepers loaded down and if they do, I doubt they convey there concern on an internet forum, so this too I'm not concerned with. Although, you never know who is lurking and unfortunately not responding to this thread.
What I AM concerned with is those of us that share an interest to figure out the cause, effect, and potential solution for correction. Bringing the "why don't this sect of motorcyclist complain about the wobble" into this conversation is a mute point as far as I'm concerned because as I expressed...........given the right conditions ALL FLH's will wag. Is it life threatening? Only if the frame grenades, in which I have never heard of this happening, HOWEVER, what we don't know or have evidence of is how many accidents have happened because of loss of control related to the issue of wag brought before us in this thread...........hmmmm........
Having said that, I also believe that no one product is "better" than the other, HOWEVER, I've refocused my attention on which one will correct the wag with the least amount of stress transmitted to the frame and rider....ie more vibration.
After giving this some thought, and since I do not have any feedback from a professional that can provide scientific feedback I'm going to choose the device that attaches to a LARGE surface area on my bike with minimal interference........that being but not limited to add-ons and curb height where bike to ground clearance is not an issue.
Unless someone can provide info on how much stress the cleve block area of the bike can endure, and not a simple "we've been doing it for years this way with no ill effects" cause I don't operate like this, I'm going with a cross member mounted device. I presented this thread in search of some cold hard scientific data in an attempt to get some of these "developers of these products" to chime in but to no avail.
To each his own, but I feel I'm armed with enough info and have made the decision to go with the Bagger Brace.
I'm not pimping jack ****, have no dog in this hunt, and certainly don't care what others buy, sell, or trade, but I will give this 100% money back guaranteed with free shipping offering a try and will report my findings as I wait patiently for either a manufacturer of these devices or an Engineer to come in here and disuade me from my decision.
I'll be over there----------------------------> waiting with baited breath.
EDIT: I'm not bashing, speaking ill, or conveying a negative message towards ANYONE or ANY PRODUCT but instead merely speaking out loud amongst friends and patrons that share a common interest of motorcycling. Nothing more, nothing less. I've eaten crow more than one time in my life and for the sake of learning, could eat some more.
I too believe every FLH has a bit of wobble under the right conditions, but I'm really not here to debate whether one has it or not. As for the motorcops? I doubt most spend as much time blazing thru long sweepers loaded down and if they do, I doubt they convey there concern on an internet forum, so this too I'm not concerned with. Although, you never know who is lurking and unfortunately not responding to this thread.
What I AM concerned with is those of us that share an interest to figure out the cause, effect, and potential solution for correction. Bringing the "why don't this sect of motorcyclist complain about the wobble" into this conversation is a mute point as far as I'm concerned because as I expressed...........given the right conditions ALL FLH's will wag. Is it life threatening? Only if the frame grenades, in which I have never heard of this happening, HOWEVER, what we don't know or have evidence of is how many accidents have happened because of loss of control related to the issue of wag brought before us in this thread...........hmmmm........
Having said that, I also believe that no one product is "better" than the other, HOWEVER, I've refocused my attention on which one will correct the wag with the least amount of stress transmitted to the frame and rider....ie more vibration.
After giving this some thought, and since I do not have any feedback from a professional that can provide scientific feedback I'm going to choose the device that attaches to a LARGE surface area on my bike with minimal interference........that being but not limited to add-ons and curb height where bike to ground clearance is not an issue.
Unless someone can provide info on how much stress the cleve block area of the bike can endure, and not a simple "we've been doing it for years this way with no ill effects" cause I don't operate like this, I'm going with a cross member mounted device. I presented this thread in search of some cold hard scientific data in an attempt to get some of these "developers of these products" to chime in but to no avail.
To each his own, but I feel I'm armed with enough info and have made the decision to go with the Bagger Brace.
I'm not pimping jack ****, have no dog in this hunt, and certainly don't care what others buy, sell, or trade, but I will give this 100% money back guaranteed with free shipping offering a try and will report my findings as I wait patiently for either a manufacturer of these devices or an Engineer to come in here and disuade me from my decision.
I'll be over there----------------------------> waiting with baited breath.
EDIT: I'm not bashing, speaking ill, or conveying a negative message towards ANYONE or ANY PRODUCT but instead merely speaking out loud amongst friends and patrons that share a common interest of motorcycling. Nothing more, nothing less. I've eaten crow more than one time in my life and for the sake of learning, could eat some more.
Last edited by UltraKla$$ic; Aug 23, 2008 at 08:20 AM.
Banned
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 581
Likes: 0
From: Langley
Might as well make this my first post, I've been lurking for a while, having owned 6 FLH's over the years. I recently put a Bagger-Brace on my bike after seeing it at a rally. Bike handles better than anything I have ridden. I'm a believer and I would say it's money well spent.