Foot board vibration
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Joined: Jan 2009
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I don't wanna beat this to death, but I'll attempt to explain my reasoning behind suggesting he look at the front mount. My reply was based on actual experience-not with motorcycles-but with nuclear submarines.
On the nuc boats we spent several billion $$ toward reducing our ambient and trans hull sound levels. One of the methods we employed was to sound isolate every pump and machine by using sound mounts that look EXACTLY like the front motor mount on your big twin....Yep, they look exactly the same except they come in various sizes.
From there we installed a sound analysis system where we routinely monitored each piece of equipment.....The monitoring program quickly revealed that the sound mounts needed to be replaced as they aged and especially if subjected to certain chemicals, then they needed to be replaced much more often. One of the chemicals turned out to be plain old fossil based oils...That lead to developing mounts made of different materials to be used on equipment subject to oil contamination.
Seldom did we see a total failure of the rubber mounts, but instead a decrease in it's ability to isolate vibration due to age, and/or chemical exposure and/or severe duty cycles.
If you ain't noticed, your HD engine dances violently at idle, so you can call that severe duty. And seeing as how it routinely gets bathed in engine oil, then you can expect it to lose it's isolating properties over time.....
Now, if you recall the original poster's complaint, he stated that OVER TIME he has felt an increase in vibrations in his floorboards....now you know why I suggested he look at his front lower motor mount.
On the nuc boats we spent several billion $$ toward reducing our ambient and trans hull sound levels. One of the methods we employed was to sound isolate every pump and machine by using sound mounts that look EXACTLY like the front motor mount on your big twin....Yep, they look exactly the same except they come in various sizes.
From there we installed a sound analysis system where we routinely monitored each piece of equipment.....The monitoring program quickly revealed that the sound mounts needed to be replaced as they aged and especially if subjected to certain chemicals, then they needed to be replaced much more often. One of the chemicals turned out to be plain old fossil based oils...That lead to developing mounts made of different materials to be used on equipment subject to oil contamination.
Seldom did we see a total failure of the rubber mounts, but instead a decrease in it's ability to isolate vibration due to age, and/or chemical exposure and/or severe duty cycles.
If you ain't noticed, your HD engine dances violently at idle, so you can call that severe duty. And seeing as how it routinely gets bathed in engine oil, then you can expect it to lose it's isolating properties over time.....
Now, if you recall the original poster's complaint, he stated that OVER TIME he has felt an increase in vibrations in his floorboards....now you know why I suggested he look at his front lower motor mount.
Last edited by oinker02; Dec 24, 2009 at 12:39 AM.
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Joined: Jan 2009
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But like one guy here suggested, always go with Dynabeads. No matter how well a tire is manufactured, it eventually will lose it initial balance as it wears and/or if a weight flys/knocked off. Dynabeads will keep the tire balanced, but they can't help if the tire was poorly constructed and will at first mask the problem then the cupping will eventually increase to the point it eclipses even the Dynabeads ability to smooth things.
Believe it or not, tire cupping on a two wheeled vehicle is almost never associated with an out of balance condition, but almost always due to tire construction defects. On three and four wheeled vehicles, you gotta first eliminate alignment and balance questions before you can associate cupping with manufacturing defects, but on a scooter the dymanics and geometry are different.
Back in 1980 I had a Datsun 280Z that had a factory set of Toyo tires that had some really bad issues. They all four cupped and rattled like crazy. After several dealer attempts to realign and rebalance the tires, they swapped them out and the problem went away. Eventually Toyo discovered they had shipped quite a few poorly manufactured tires and made good on them.
Okay my '09 Ultra has started getting a vibration in the foot boards. I started feeling it only occasionaly but now it is present all the time. For you oldtimers, it feels like the foot pegs on your old BSA or Triumph. It is a hard vibration like metal to metal, feels like the motor is touching the frame somewhere. I suspect a motor mount is letting go, so I took it to the dealer (still under warranty) and asked them to check it out. Their answer was everthing seems okay. It does not feel like it did a year and a half ago and is getting worse, so I am going back to the dealer and get the sales manager to ride it to compare to other late model Ultras, I don't expect much but have to try. Has anyone else noticed something like that on the new frame bikes?
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Road Warrior
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,807
Likes: 33
From: TEXAS
Yeah I have 407's, I have been keeping an eye on them, I got about 8000 miles on them now, and they are doing pretty good, I would be changing out the rear by now on my "05 Ultra. Since it is still in warranty I am going to take it in next week and see what them come up with. I have low expectations though, I will still probably have to change out the motor mount myself.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 11,476
Likes: 3,004
From: Charleston, SC
The 09+ front motor mount is no longer directly under the oil filter. There are motor mounts (2) now and it's too early to suspect them being bad. I've never heard anyone with a bad front motor mount on these bikes...yet.
My 09 Ultra started to increase in vibration just like the OP's. Turned out it was the exhaust. I removed the rear crossover hanger just for ***** and giggles and the vibration disappeared. I then loosened all the clamps and flanges, slipons, and slipon mounts, jiggled all the crap around to loosen everything, then reinstalled the crossover hanger first and then tightened everything else moving forward. The vibration was finally gone.
My vibration was so bad the windshield whistled!
lp
My 09 Ultra started to increase in vibration just like the OP's. Turned out it was the exhaust. I removed the rear crossover hanger just for ***** and giggles and the vibration disappeared. I then loosened all the clamps and flanges, slipons, and slipon mounts, jiggled all the crap around to loosen everything, then reinstalled the crossover hanger first and then tightened everything else moving forward. The vibration was finally gone.
My vibration was so bad the windshield whistled!
lp
Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,939
Likes: 3
From: TX
If he's got 8k miles on the tires, then the motor mounts have at least that many too.
While it would SEEM way to early to have a problem with it, one would be foolish to rule it out without investigation. **** happens.
My first bet would be the front headpipe or heatshield hitting one of the floor board brackets.
The tire cupping issue would certainly introduce vibration, but I'd be surprised if it were localized to the floor boards ~ more likely you'd feel it in the bars or seat of your pants.
One other thing.... I know ya said it's worse now than in the past, but the various "custom" floor borad inserts that HD sells, have softer isolation bulbs (those round rubber ***** between the bd and the insert) that make them "feel" MUCH smoother than the stock plain rubber bd inserts. Do you have the stockers or have you swapped them out? If you have not swapped them, as silly as it sounds, the ones H$ sells with the various chrome BS trim actually "ride" better than the stock ones. If you have already swapped them, check & make sure a small stone or piece of debris has not gotten lodged between the insert and the board itself.
All that said.... my $$ is still on the pipe.
While it would SEEM way to early to have a problem with it, one would be foolish to rule it out without investigation. **** happens.
My first bet would be the front headpipe or heatshield hitting one of the floor board brackets.
The tire cupping issue would certainly introduce vibration, but I'd be surprised if it were localized to the floor boards ~ more likely you'd feel it in the bars or seat of your pants.
One other thing.... I know ya said it's worse now than in the past, but the various "custom" floor borad inserts that HD sells, have softer isolation bulbs (those round rubber ***** between the bd and the insert) that make them "feel" MUCH smoother than the stock plain rubber bd inserts. Do you have the stockers or have you swapped them out? If you have not swapped them, as silly as it sounds, the ones H$ sells with the various chrome BS trim actually "ride" better than the stock ones. If you have already swapped them, check & make sure a small stone or piece of debris has not gotten lodged between the insert and the board itself.
All that said.... my $$ is still on the pipe.
Thread Starter
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Road Warrior
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,807
Likes: 33
From: TEXAS
The 09+ front motor mount is no longer directly under the oil filter. There are motor mounts (2) now and it's too early to suspect them being bad. I've never heard anyone with a bad front motor mount on these bikes...yet.
My 09 Ultra started to increase in vibration just like the OP's. Turned out it was the exhaust. I removed the rear crossover hanger just for ***** and giggles and the vibration disappeared. I then loosened all the clamps and flanges, slipons, and slipon mounts, jiggled all the crap around to loosen everything, then reinstalled the crossover hanger first and then tightened everything else moving forward. The vibration was finally gone.
My vibration was so bad the windshield whistled!
lp
My 09 Ultra started to increase in vibration just like the OP's. Turned out it was the exhaust. I removed the rear crossover hanger just for ***** and giggles and the vibration disappeared. I then loosened all the clamps and flanges, slipons, and slipon mounts, jiggled all the crap around to loosen everything, then reinstalled the crossover hanger first and then tightened everything else moving forward. The vibration was finally gone.
My vibration was so bad the windshield whistled!
lp
Thread Starter
|
Road Warrior
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,807
Likes: 33
From: TEXAS
If he's got 8k miles on the tires, then the motor mounts have at least that many too.
While it would SEEM way to early to have a problem with it, one would be foolish to rule it out without investigation. **** happens.
My first bet would be the front headpipe or heatshield hitting one of the floor board brackets.
The tire cupping issue would certainly introduce vibration, but I'd be surprised if it were localized to the floor boards ~ more likely you'd feel it in the bars or seat of your pants.
One other thing.... I know ya said it's worse now than in the past, but the various "custom" floor borad inserts that HD sells, have softer isolation bulbs (those round rubber ***** between the bd and the insert) that make them "feel" MUCH smoother than the stock plain rubber bd inserts. Do you have the stockers or have you swapped them out? If you have not swapped them, as silly as it sounds, the ones H$ sells with the various chrome BS trim actually "ride" better than the stock ones. If you have already swapped them, check & make sure a small stone or piece of debris has not gotten lodged between the insert and the board itself.
All that said.... my $$ is still on the pipe.
While it would SEEM way to early to have a problem with it, one would be foolish to rule it out without investigation. **** happens.
My first bet would be the front headpipe or heatshield hitting one of the floor board brackets.
The tire cupping issue would certainly introduce vibration, but I'd be surprised if it were localized to the floor boards ~ more likely you'd feel it in the bars or seat of your pants.
One other thing.... I know ya said it's worse now than in the past, but the various "custom" floor borad inserts that HD sells, have softer isolation bulbs (those round rubber ***** between the bd and the insert) that make them "feel" MUCH smoother than the stock plain rubber bd inserts. Do you have the stockers or have you swapped them out? If you have not swapped them, as silly as it sounds, the ones H$ sells with the various chrome BS trim actually "ride" better than the stock ones. If you have already swapped them, check & make sure a small stone or piece of debris has not gotten lodged between the insert and the board itself.
All that said.... my $$ is still on the pipe.
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Joe Kucinski
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 11,476
Likes: 3,004
From: Charleston, SC
Good luck with the issue. You'll get it.
lp
Thread Starter
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Road Warrior
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,807
Likes: 33
From: TEXAS
The 09+ front motor mount is no longer directly under the oil filter. There are motor mounts (2) now and it's too early to suspect them being bad. I've never heard anyone with a bad front motor mount on these bikes...yet.
My 09 Ultra started to increase in vibration just like the OP's. Turned out it was the exhaust. I removed the rear crossover hanger just for ***** and giggles and the vibration disappeared. I then loosened all the clamps and flanges, slipons, and slipon mounts, jiggled all the crap around to loosen everything, then reinstalled the crossover hanger first and then tightened everything else moving forward. The vibration was finally gone.
My vibration was so bad the windshield whistled!
lp
My 09 Ultra started to increase in vibration just like the OP's. Turned out it was the exhaust. I removed the rear crossover hanger just for ***** and giggles and the vibration disappeared. I then loosened all the clamps and flanges, slipons, and slipon mounts, jiggled all the crap around to loosen everything, then reinstalled the crossover hanger first and then tightened everything else moving forward. The vibration was finally gone.
My vibration was so bad the windshield whistled!
lp
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