2024 rumors
HDF Community Team
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 4,347
Likes: 3,392
From: Seattle
The reason why Indian went and locked it down is because they dont sell end users a tuner device and get their dealerships extra money through making you have to flash the bike at the dealership to be able to use their upgrades.
So they have no reason to develop a tuner or allow any access to the ECM. They've had it locked down from day 1, and they don't give a ****.
HD makes a lot of money by selling parts to DIYers including 2 generations of tuning devices you can still buy today. Any ECU access they give, will eventually be cracked via the same method they use for their own tuning device's access.
Road Warrior
Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 1,322
Likes: 731
From: Pennsylvania
Will they drop the 107?
Most of the 2023 Cruiser & Touring bikes are 114 or 117. The Softail standard and the Street/Road Glide standards are the only bikes using the 107. It seems that there's extra work (and cost) involved in producing the specific parts for, and having an assembly line for the smaller motor that's only installed on a couple of models.
It would make more sense to drop the 107 and go with the 114 for regular models, the 117 for higher end models, and the 121 for the CVO's.
Most of the 2023 Cruiser & Touring bikes are 114 or 117. The Softail standard and the Street/Road Glide standards are the only bikes using the 107. It seems that there's extra work (and cost) involved in producing the specific parts for, and having an assembly line for the smaller motor that's only installed on a couple of models.
It would make more sense to drop the 107 and go with the 114 for regular models, the 117 for higher end models, and the 121 for the CVO's.
Personally, also, I would "open up" the paint schemes to cross over to many more bikes. Sure keep the CVOs special. I get that. But there is nothing wrong with having the same color on a touring bike as on a smaller softail. I like that color blue, for example, but I do not want a big touring bike to get it. An aside, what's with the 2022 Ultra in blue & black "making sense" by having the black in the center and blue on the sides? Whereas on the Heritage that dual combo was opposite on the tank vs. the fenders? Other Heritage colors in recent years have been the same way. Sorry my ADD just cannot accept that LOL
2nd Gear
Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 6
Likes: 0
From: Nebraska
I see speculation on emissions, not really exciting. I'm wondering if they'll update their instruments so that 21k bikes aren't wearing barely-readable calculator screens pretending to be instruments.
Last edited by Ralpf Muchachio; Nov 9, 2023 at 10:47 AM.
Stellar HDF Member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,395
Likes: 153
From: Utah
And ride with the stock ECM, Pipes, and Injectors for at least 500 mi.They will probably check inside the cam case also... on the way to tearing your engine down to repair the failure. No SE cams included.
Road Warrior
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,949
Likes: 288
Not likely. Harley is pushing their new fancy SE tuner that is EPA friendly and connects to your cellphone.
The reason why Indian went and locked it down is because they dont sell end users a tuner device and get their dealerships extra money through making you have to flash the bike at the dealership to be able to use their upgrades.
So they have no reason to develop a tuner or allow any access to the ECM. They've had it locked down from day 1, and they don't give a ****.
HD makes a lot of money by selling parts to DIYers including 2 generations of tuning devices you can still buy today. Any ECU access they give, will eventually be cracked via the same method they use for their own tuning device's access.
The reason why Indian went and locked it down is because they dont sell end users a tuner device and get their dealerships extra money through making you have to flash the bike at the dealership to be able to use their upgrades.
So they have no reason to develop a tuner or allow any access to the ECM. They've had it locked down from day 1, and they don't give a ****.
HD makes a lot of money by selling parts to DIYers including 2 generations of tuning devices you can still buy today. Any ECU access they give, will eventually be cracked via the same method they use for their own tuning device's access.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 22,999
Likes: 11,439
There's a big class action lawsuit against Deere by farms, don't know where it's at. Could be stuck in courts forever. I remember customers were peeved at Cummins when we locked down ECM's for authorized service tools only - but you should know that EPA mandated it, Cummins benefited from it but would not have done so independently.
All part of giving HD some cover.
My 2020 RGL is my last new Harley. I purchased a Kubotaa rather than a JD this year. Have a Centurion for the HD. Allows me to work on it.
Last edited by smitty901; Nov 12, 2023 at 06:43 AM.
Tourer
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 436
Likes: 71
"In essence, there is simply no need for an owner to modify the fuelling of an engine"
I say we force politicians who think like this to be chained to a HD on a 95°F day, stuck in city traffic. Ignorance should be no excuse for the stupidity of the laws they create. I say we bake them all.
I say we force politicians who think like this to be chained to a HD on a 95°F day, stuck in city traffic. Ignorance should be no excuse for the stupidity of the laws they create. I say we bake them all.
Road Captain
Joined: Oct 2019
Posts: 536
Likes: 252
From: Western Australia
"In essence, there is simply no need for an owner to modify the fuelling of an engine"
I say we force politicians who think like this to be chained to a HD on a 95°F day, stuck in city traffic. Ignorance should be no excuse for the stupidity of the laws they create. I say we bake them all.
I say we force politicians who think like this to be chained to a HD on a 95°F day, stuck in city traffic. Ignorance should be no excuse for the stupidity of the laws they create. I say we bake them all.
You're right- legislators won't ride or drive what they create. golf clubs and yacht clubs are a long way from emissions.
Maybe we need to get them hooked on motorcycles.
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Road Captain
Joined: Oct 2019
Posts: 536
Likes: 252
From: Western Australia
Hi everyone, I am sorry that the thread was hijacked to an emissions discussion.
If anyone has any news on the 2024 models then sing out. Dealers are saying NOTHING, which is very rare.
Here in Australia, only the dealer principals have seen the '24 models as of Friday last week which is unheard of. NDA's everywhere too, so I am suspecting that there is some big things happening- maybe the trickle down from the CVO bodywork and chassis is happening earlier than I suspected.
If anyone has any news on the 2024 models then sing out. Dealers are saying NOTHING, which is very rare.
Here in Australia, only the dealer principals have seen the '24 models as of Friday last week which is unheard of. NDA's everywhere too, so I am suspecting that there is some big things happening- maybe the trickle down from the CVO bodywork and chassis is happening earlier than I suspected.
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Mar 21, 2017 07:23 PM