OK so I have an FP3 and gave it up for the PV. Don't get me wrong, the FP3 has most of the tables available for you to edit, through your phone/tablet...

1. while it is connected to your bike and powered on. My PV I think about stuff and copy tables from one tune to another, all offline in the comfort of the house on the computer with the bike tucked away for the night
   
2. That phone/tablet App is nowhere near as easy to use, or see what his going on with curves and such as a proper computer program
   
3. Most important of all, there is no logging so who knows what is going on, even then the number of signals the display can show is nowhere near as useful as the PV ...they don't show spark knock for example
   
4. Oh yea, and remember "Autotune" is not an automatic tuner that negates the need for someone that knows what they are doing. Stage 1 maybe but spark knock/timing, CDE, AE/DE, edit in your own AFR table ...YOU have to do all yourself ...with that App interface, connected to the bike, outside in the cold

Or, trust V&H to write your map and just get on with it. Stage 1 is "maybe" DIY but anything bigger, needs someone that knows what they are doing ...just my experience anyway.

You've got it so you could try it. If someone else has a PV for example I think (?? not 100%sure) you could borrow it and get a data log (anyone confirm that?)

Good luck with the build

 

Fuelpak FP3 is an ECM tuner. You can adjust ECM values as well as spark timing values. But it's fairly new and not many shops tune with it. You have to rely on the canned tunes from V&H.

 

I think Gordon61 hit the high points and I am not inclined to get into the weeds on the benefits of the Power Vision or Mastertune over the FP3 but there are many. Anyone interested in learning those benefits can do the due diligence others have done to learn for themselves and make an informed decision rather than rely on what is posted on this forum. But here is the Cliffnotes on the two.

Both have a very similar autotune function, which really amounts to an automation of the classic log tuning function. So yes, the FP3 can tune your bike.

I wouldn't worry too much about the availability of canned tunes; IMHO, they're a waste of time. Compare the maps to your stock tune and you will find that many things get changed in the more obscure settings and those are much deeper than VE and displacement. Additionally there is no one size fits all map; they are usually not even close and even if the build configuration is the same, each is different and requires a dyno tune for that specific configuration to optimize performance. One has a better chance of developing a better map with the autotune function.

Using the FP3, locks you to the V&H library and their tech support, which, from what I understand is pretty good. By default the tech support has to be good but you are still locked in to V&H. All tunes come from V&H and all editing has to be done on your phone (tedious) and there is no way to receive a tune from the vendor of your engine kit or to merge in portions of another tune or anything like that. The Powervision by comparison is a full feature product with really nice tools for doing all those things.

The other big difference is the lack of wideband support for the FP3. You're stuck with narrow band tuning. The Powervision by comparison has a couple of different wide band add-on options, one of which is closed-loop.

Another good reason to avoid the FP3 is that most tuners will not try to tune with the FP3 because it is tedious and does not log data.

I will add one more reason. V&H is saying the FP3 will produce 112/115 numbers and I have seen tire shredder kits tuned with the Power Vision or Mastertune producing better numbers. I understand that the various "stage" numbers are used rather loosely and configurations vary and there are "compliant" and "race" kits so a numbers comparison is not fair without knowing the precise build configuration. The OP has referred to a Stage 4 kit but then also refers to it as the "tire shredder" kit. There are two tire shredder kits, a compliant kit and a race kit and both are Stage V, so to get into a numbers discussion, we would need to know what kit we are talking about.

The FP3 would be OK for a Stage I or Stage 1 with mild cams configuration but once the configuration involves larger displacement, higher flowing heads, higher compression and longer cams, the FP3 is very lacking. Personally I think the 'vision is worth the extra money. It's not something to scrimp on, bite the bullet, do it once, do it right, and be done with it.

 

So Thank you all for you information and for helping me towards the choice I know I would have had to make in the end. I do want it dyno tuned, to spend all that money and then cheap out in the end would be stupid. I just needed some voices of reason, lesson learned. It cost me $330.00 this time. Can't take it with you.

 

To Answer your Question djl, it is the non compliant kit, thats the only one that fits Softails, the compliant one only fits baggers. It seems like it should be considered a stage V kit, but the SE catalog lists it as stage IV. Not really sure what the hell the difference is, both have the same parts 4.0 cylinders, 10.2-1 pistons, 58mm throttle body, hi flow injectors, ported cylinder heads, 259E cams, pushrods, lifters and clutch spring. Adding a billet cam plate with a high vol. oil pump as well. Kit#92500037A. With heavy breather and aftermarket exhaust it claims 112h 115t, that I'm sure is under rated. Would love to see bigger numbers while still having a bike you can ride like a stocker. Thanks again for the input and the push in the right direction.

 

The MoCo may not agree but these 110 cylinders will fit any HD with the OEM case bore. I believe there are now pistons available for the 4.00" stroke motor and some are installing them on TC88 cases.

I attached a couple of dyno sheets to support my comment about better numbers with a proper tune.

 

Really? from 88 straight to 110, that would be great for guys with older bikes. But I could understand why the MoCo doesn't want that known, probably not good for new bike sales. I also thought the 88s did not have as strong a bottom end as the later motors.

Hell yes, thats the kind of numbers I was hoping to see with the right tuning.

 

No, 88" to 100"; remember the TC88 has a 4" stroke as opposed to the 96"/103" motors with the 4.375" crank. Oh contraire, you have been misinformed on the early cranks. Up through the '02 model year, the lower units were near bullet proof. Hot forged cranks and Timken left crank bearing. Of course, any crank can be twisted but you don't hear of many of the early model tweaking cranks.