Oil pump or drive?
HDF Community Team
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 5,421
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From: NC USA
Took the exhaust off to get better access.
Removed plug and spring. this area was full of oil.
Removed the ball bearing, and the oil disappeared.
Added the funnel with oil. The oil level went down quite a bit (small funnel)....then stopped.
No oil came out where the ball bearing was.
Put it all back and turned the engine over.....nothing.
Removed plug and spring. this area was full of oil.
Removed the ball bearing, and the oil disappeared.
Added the funnel with oil. The oil level went down quite a bit (small funnel)....then stopped.
No oil came out where the ball bearing was.
Put it all back and turned the engine over.....nothing.
It takes a bit for the oil to ooze thru the gears and back up to the ball cavity. So maybe try it again and and continue with adding oil to the funnel until it does come out that hole. Button it up, oil in funnel again, turn it over and see if the pumps pulls it down from the funnel.
We're all hoping it's something simple like Sparky mentioned, but if this last procedure doesn't work, it's not the pump itself, but something deeper at the drive end. I have a good idea of what you'll find in there, but will wait for this last try before mentioning.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 21,116
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From: Poolville
Question, Before this all started did you do anything to the motor? anything at all??
Because what I noticed in an earlier post with pic's is that you do not appear to have the Stock Oil pump.. And If I remember correctly Some after market pumps required a different gasket that was related to oil flow in the pump.. I could be wrong but that pump does not look stock..
Because what I noticed in an earlier post with pic's is that you do not appear to have the Stock Oil pump.. And If I remember correctly Some after market pumps required a different gasket that was related to oil flow in the pump.. I could be wrong but that pump does not look stock..
Thread Starter
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Cruiser
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 189
Likes: 39
From: Guildford, UK
Question, Before this all started did you do anything to the motor? anything at all??
Because what I noticed in an earlier post with pic's is that you do not appear to have the Stock Oil pump.. And If I remember correctly Some after market pumps required a different gasket that was related to oil flow in the pump.. I could be wrong but that pump does not look stock..
Because what I noticed in an earlier post with pic's is that you do not appear to have the Stock Oil pump.. And If I remember correctly Some after market pumps required a different gasket that was related to oil flow in the pump.. I could be wrong but that pump does not look stock..
I ordered a stock gasket for the cover, and it fitted perfectly. ....and was the same as the one I took off.
Externally it looks the same as a friends '93 Fatboy.
Updated photo.....
It does have a removable chrome cover....maybe that's fooling you?
Last edited by splittie65; May 21, 2022 at 09:14 AM.
Thread Starter
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Cruiser
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 189
Likes: 39
From: Guildford, UK
That's the check ball, keeps oil from dripping thru the pump into the engine when not running. Oil above it is normal.
It takes a bit for the oil to ooze thru the gears and back up to the ball cavity. So maybe try it again and and continue with adding oil to the funnel until it does come out that hole. Button it up, oil in funnel again, turn it over and see if the pumps pulls it down from the funnel.
We're all hoping it's something simple like Sparky mentioned, but if this last procedure doesn't work, it's not the pump itself, but something deeper at the drive end. I have a good idea of what you'll find in there, but will wait for this last try before mentioning.
It takes a bit for the oil to ooze thru the gears and back up to the ball cavity. So maybe try it again and and continue with adding oil to the funnel until it does come out that hole. Button it up, oil in funnel again, turn it over and see if the pumps pulls it down from the funnel.
We're all hoping it's something simple like Sparky mentioned, but if this last procedure doesn't work, it's not the pump itself, but something deeper at the drive end. I have a good idea of what you'll find in there, but will wait for this last try before mentioning.
I have left it ball out and funnel with oil.
I'll leave it as long as required to get oil coming out the check valve hole.
Is it possible there is a blockage between the hose entry and the ball valve?
Although I did blow through the hose entry point when the cover was last off and there was no blockage there
HDF Community Team
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 5,421
Likes: 2,621
From: NC USA
I have left it ball out and funnel with oil.
I'll leave it as long as required to get oil coming out the check valve hole.
Is it possible there is a blockage between the hose entry and the ball valve?
Although I did blow through the hose entry point when the cover was last off and there was no blockage there
I'll leave it as long as required to get oil coming out the check valve hole.
Is it possible there is a blockage between the hose entry and the ball valve?
Although I did blow through the hose entry point when the cover was last off and there was no blockage there
Oil should get thru the funnel/hose/cover/gears up to the check ball seat/cavity within a minute or 2 at the very longest, provided the oil level in funnel is above the pump. If not, disconnect everything, remove the cover and plug/spring/ball and blow thru from the top. Don't worry about new gaskets every time until this is resolved.
I did find remnants of a chewed up "blue" mechanics paper towel in the return fitting off the pump one time...
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Cruiser
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 189
Likes: 39
From: Guildford, UK
Considering the oil immediately "disappeared" when you removed the ball, I doubt it but anything is possible. It's a straight shot from the gear cavity to the check ball seat as the photo drawing. Though I suppose if something foreign is lodged in that drilling, it could act as a check in reverse.
Oil should get thru the funnel/hose/cover/gears up to the check ball seat/cavity within a minute or 2 at the very longest, provided the oil level in funnel is above the pump. If not, disconnect everything, remove the cover and plug/spring/ball and blow thru from the top. Don't worry about new gaskets every time until this is resolved.
I did find remnants of a chewed up "blue" mechanics paper towel in the return fitting off the pump one time...
As you can see from my above photo the funnel is well above the check valve.
It has been 30minutes and with the aid of a torch I can see oil is just starting to come up.......but not reached the top yet!
HDF Community Team
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 5,421
Likes: 2,621
From: NC USA
OK. with a small funnel, not near the same gravity pressure as would be from a full tank of oil. So just let it continue until oil is to the top of the threads and running over. Yes, it makes a mess. (Air bubble from beneath can push oil but still cause issue)
When that's done, replace the ball, spring and cap. Turn it over with a hole open (screen or sender) and see if oil comes out then.
When that's done, replace the ball, spring and cap. Turn it over with a hole open (screen or sender) and see if oil comes out then.
Last edited by t150vej; May 21, 2022 at 09:43 AM.
Thread Starter
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Cruiser
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 189
Likes: 39
From: Guildford, UK
Having just written my last message, the oil reached the top....so i put the ball etc back.
The screen is out.....turned the engine over for about 15 seconds.......no oil in the screen aperture ......and oil level in funnel didn't go down.
The screen is out.....turned the engine over for about 15 seconds.......no oil in the screen aperture ......and oil level in funnel didn't go down.
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HDF Community Team
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 5,421
Likes: 2,621
From: NC USA
Proper way is to pull the rockers if you don't have adjustable push rods. But there's another way to get it off, just to take a look. I can walk you thru it and don't mind at all, but have some things I need to be doing for a while today.
As I said early on, these pumps and drive are normally very reliable. They've been using the same basic design for 40+ years. If what I suspect has happened, the engine will be coming out anyway so doing the "cheat" way to get the cover off would probably be good a way as any.
Scroll down to post #14 on this thread and you'll see what has probably happened. https://www.hdforums.com/forum/evo-c...hat-to-do.html
Thread Starter
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Cruiser
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 189
Likes: 39
From: Guildford, UK
Well, it's on the drive end in that case. Cam cover needs to come off.
Proper way is to pull the rockers if you don't have adjustable push rods. But there's another way to get it off, just to take a look. I can walk you thru it and don't mind at all, but have some things I need to be doing for a while today.
As I said early on, these pumps and drive are normally very reliable. They've been using the same basic design for 40+ years. If what I suspect has happened, the engine will be coming out anyway so doing the "cheat" way to get the cover off would probably be good a way as any.
Scroll down to post #14 on this thread and you'll see what has probably happened. https://www.hdforums.com/forum/evo-c...hat-to-do.html
Proper way is to pull the rockers if you don't have adjustable push rods. But there's another way to get it off, just to take a look. I can walk you thru it and don't mind at all, but have some things I need to be doing for a while today.
As I said early on, these pumps and drive are normally very reliable. They've been using the same basic design for 40+ years. If what I suspect has happened, the engine will be coming out anyway so doing the "cheat" way to get the cover off would probably be good a way as any.
Scroll down to post #14 on this thread and you'll see what has probably happened. https://www.hdforums.com/forum/evo-c...hat-to-do.html
All help greatly appreciated!
I too have things to do today......and will look at it again tomorrow.
It would be good to determine what is wrong, even if I don't mend it immediately.
Looks like i might need to get another bike for my tour around Europe in July
