Dilligaf
Road Master
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 934
Likes: 0
From: PNW, USA
You head and life - your choice period. the GOV shouldn't tell you how to life your life only if it doesn't hurt others or stops them for living their's...
Many thoughts out there. Sure at a certain speed the helmet does nothing to save you. The weight of your brain (i.e. inertia) hitting your skull will hurt you even if you skull stays intact. However at speeds below that it can be a life saver. I have one friend who tagged a truck from behind while looking back to merge. Pho helmet and 4 weeks in the hospital. Had to learn to walk again, but he rides on. The impact was at 25mph and he ended up in the truck bed. If he had a DOT helmet, doctor says most likely no injuries because only his skull was hurt.
I always love it when someone uses an extreme example to back up their point of view. Oh helmets are of little help since at 70MPH they will not save you. Well many miles are driven at 0-45MPH - at least I do. I ride everyday, everywhere. Its my go-to vehicle.
Do what you want. However, that said, your choice can not be a burden to society i.e. if you choose to ride w/o one we don't have to fit the bill for your medical expenses - period. That is our right. So I say if you choose to not use one you should be required by law to have medical insurance for your bike that covers all riders with or without a helmet - you must have a rider on your policy which specifically covers no helmet riding. If not you must have a $25,000 (or maybe higher) bond for medical coverage.
Just like you I should not be told how to live my life and what to do - i.e. be taxed or pay higher fees for insurance (or whatever) to cover you choice to have much higher risk. Your freedom isn't free and I for one am not going to fit the bill.
Many thoughts out there. Sure at a certain speed the helmet does nothing to save you. The weight of your brain (i.e. inertia) hitting your skull will hurt you even if you skull stays intact. However at speeds below that it can be a life saver. I have one friend who tagged a truck from behind while looking back to merge. Pho helmet and 4 weeks in the hospital. Had to learn to walk again, but he rides on. The impact was at 25mph and he ended up in the truck bed. If he had a DOT helmet, doctor says most likely no injuries because only his skull was hurt.
I always love it when someone uses an extreme example to back up their point of view. Oh helmets are of little help since at 70MPH they will not save you. Well many miles are driven at 0-45MPH - at least I do. I ride everyday, everywhere. Its my go-to vehicle.
Do what you want. However, that said, your choice can not be a burden to society i.e. if you choose to ride w/o one we don't have to fit the bill for your medical expenses - period. That is our right. So I say if you choose to not use one you should be required by law to have medical insurance for your bike that covers all riders with or without a helmet - you must have a rider on your policy which specifically covers no helmet riding. If not you must have a $25,000 (or maybe higher) bond for medical coverage.
Just like you I should not be told how to live my life and what to do - i.e. be taxed or pay higher fees for insurance (or whatever) to cover you choice to have much higher risk. Your freedom isn't free and I for one am not going to fit the bill.
Last edited by PhotoRider; Apr 18, 2013 at 02:36 AM.
Tourer
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 391
Likes: 0
From: Indiana
Bottom line, it isn't bikers breaking the medical bank! It is all the free loading bums who refuse to work and think the government and society owe them, who are breaking the bank. They point the finger at bikers and say "you not wearing a helmet could drive up health care costs". Why because we will pay to do what we love! Tell a lazy *ss bum who won't work to pay, and their response would be.... IF YOU WANT ME TO PAY THAT YOU WILL HAVE TO GIVE ME MORE MONEY! So don't talk about how "it's fair"
Road Master
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 934
Likes: 0
From: PNW, USA
Bottom line, it isn't bikers breaking the medical bank! It is all the free loading bums who refuse to work and think the government and society owe them, who are breaking the bank. They point the finger at bikers and say "you not wearing a helmet could drive up health care costs". Why because we will pay to do what we love! Tell a lazy *ss bum who won't work to pay, and their response would be.... IF YOU WANT ME TO PAY THAT YOU WILL HAVE TO GIVE ME MORE MONEY! So don't talk about how "it's fair"
My point was everybody must live by the same rules. If someone can't tell you how to live, neither can you tell others. I will not fit someone else's bill because that telling how to live. My choice.
Nobody was talking about free loading bums on welfare. Don't confuse the subject since it has nothing to do with the matter being discussed. The GOV makes helmet laws based on the effect on society and that's most financial risk. They can't make laws for bums to pay their way, if they could they would be in jail or not a bum.
I for one pride myself about trying to put more into society that taking from it. I don't always succeed in the short term, but in the long term I believe I do. I can only control myself and I choose to do that. I will not say I will do something else because so-in-so is doing this or that. That's their problem. I'm going to live my live by the same rules I expect everybody else should (but may not a.k.a bums suck everything and give nothing as they have no pride).
Tourer
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 391
Likes: 0
From: Indiana
The cost from accidents caused by cell phones far out paces the cost of people not wearing helmets... Should they make everyone who owns a cell phone and has a license have a $25000 bond for health insurance?
Road Warrior
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 1,365
Likes: 9
From: Greensboro, NC
In this day of lack of personnel responsibility, we should.
Road Master
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,086
Likes: 5
From: London, UK
I'm in the UK where helmets are required. But like other recent posters here, I support free choice: provided your choice doesn't negatively affect me (my tying up hospital services, increasing insurance premiums etc.) then I support your right to not wear a helmet if you want.
But please don't claim that wearing a helmet doesn't reduce your odds of suffering a hideous injury one day. The fact is that you (hopefully) do recognise that it does reduce your risk but value the comfort or image or feel or whatever of not wearing one more. If none of us were ever prepared to take even the slightest risks for our own enjoyment, then we wouldn't have a forum here to discuss these things.
Myself, I wear a full-face helmet. I find them more comfortable than the other options in average UK weather. I also saw a friend's girlfriend after she planted her face into the road and lost her entire lower jaw. I appreciate that the odds of that happening to me are small, but I don't suffer any discomfort by wearing a FF helmet, so where's the downside?
Now, riding a HD and wearing a FF might draw criticism from other more style-concious riders. But I'd have to be pretty vain to weight their opinions over my own safety and comfort.
YMMV
But please don't claim that wearing a helmet doesn't reduce your odds of suffering a hideous injury one day. The fact is that you (hopefully) do recognise that it does reduce your risk but value the comfort or image or feel or whatever of not wearing one more. If none of us were ever prepared to take even the slightest risks for our own enjoyment, then we wouldn't have a forum here to discuss these things.
Myself, I wear a full-face helmet. I find them more comfortable than the other options in average UK weather. I also saw a friend's girlfriend after she planted her face into the road and lost her entire lower jaw. I appreciate that the odds of that happening to me are small, but I don't suffer any discomfort by wearing a FF helmet, so where's the downside?
Now, riding a HD and wearing a FF might draw criticism from other more style-concious riders. But I'd have to be pretty vain to weight their opinions over my own safety and comfort.
YMMV
Everything we do COULD cost the tax payer/health industry. People cut fingers off using their hedge trimmer, legs get broken in skiing accidents, there are injuries in high school football and baseball games, people fall down stairs in their own home, we eat poorly leading to obesity and Diabetes and heart attacks. The list goes on and on. Either a society sucks up ALL accidents and poor choices or it doesn't.
In a country like the UK and Canada the National Health Service deals with everything whether the illness or injury is self inflicted or accidental. In the US many people have insurance but many don't leading to the Government to pay. Either way it's still a tax and we are paying for it.
I don't know how many bikers are injured in accidents with/without helmets on a year by year basis, but it's probably small potatoes compared to any and all of the above examples.
In a country like the UK and Canada the National Health Service deals with everything whether the illness or injury is self inflicted or accidental. In the US many people have insurance but many don't leading to the Government to pay. Either way it's still a tax and we are paying for it.
I don't know how many bikers are injured in accidents with/without helmets on a year by year basis, but it's probably small potatoes compared to any and all of the above examples.
Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 5,456
Likes: 2,860
From: SW FL-Jersey Shore Emigre
Interesting comment! A best friend has made many trips there for a charitable organization since the fall of the Soviet Union (and has since married a Russian woman), and says there's no question that on a day-to-day basis there's more freedom in Russia (and former republics) than here in the U.S.
I live at the Jersey Shore, and if you want to learn about "freedom" in America, just take your best girl, your dog, a pack of smokes (tobacco) and a bottle of champagne to the beach, then light a little fire to keep warm, and see what happens...
I live at the Jersey Shore, and if you want to learn about "freedom" in America, just take your best girl, your dog, a pack of smokes (tobacco) and a bottle of champagne to the beach, then light a little fire to keep warm, and see what happens...
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Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 5,456
Likes: 2,860
From: SW FL-Jersey Shore Emigre
You head and life - your choice period. the GOV shouldn't tell you how to life your life only if it doesn't hurt others or stops them for living their's...
Do what you want. However, that said, your choice can not be a burden to society i.e. if you choose to ride w/o one we don't have to fit the bill for your medical expenses - period. That is our right. So I say if you choose to not use one you should be required by law to have medical insurance for your bike that covers all riders with or without a helmet - you must have a rider on your policy which specifically covers no helmet riding. If not you must have a $25,000 (or maybe higher) bond for medical coverage.
Just like you I should not be told how to live my life and what to do - i.e. be taxed or pay higher fees for insurance (or whatever) to cover you choice to have much higher risk. Your freedom isn't free and I for one am not going to fit the bill.
Do what you want. However, that said, your choice can not be a burden to society i.e. if you choose to ride w/o one we don't have to fit the bill for your medical expenses - period. That is our right. So I say if you choose to not use one you should be required by law to have medical insurance for your bike that covers all riders with or without a helmet - you must have a rider on your policy which specifically covers no helmet riding. If not you must have a $25,000 (or maybe higher) bond for medical coverage.
Just like you I should not be told how to live my life and what to do - i.e. be taxed or pay higher fees for insurance (or whatever) to cover you choice to have much higher risk. Your freedom isn't free and I for one am not going to fit the bill.
I suspect that this is in fact true, based on the historic lack of opposition from the insurance lobby in those states where helmet laws are repealed.
And before anyone flames me, I believe in choice, and I DO choose to wear a helmet.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 10,135
Likes: 4,780
From: Sandpoint, Idaho
AIDS cost society more than head injuries do. But I don't see people saying outlaw queers. In fact they are doing the oppisite and condoning it.