Pulling timing hard cruising.
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Joined: Jan 2014
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From: tn
Pulling timing hard cruising.
Stage 1 103tc in a 2015 road king. True duals and air cleaner being tuned with a powervision. For the first little bit I had been autotuning just like I have my other bikes, got the autotunes down to around a 5% change and have been watching my gauges. Noticed going to work today that cruising down the interstate in the 80-85 mph range my front cylinder mainly, was pulling out like 9 degrees of timing at times then it will slowly trickle back down to about 3.75 then shortly after spike again. Nothing I do seems to help much pulled 2 degrees out of the entire map and still seeing the same deal. From what I've gathered the knock control on these bikes uses the spark plugs and picks up on rising pressures. Would a bad plug cause this? Bike seems to run well other than some decel pop but thats out of both cylinders mostly so doesn't seem to be the issue in the front cylinder. Exhaust leak maybe causing it to run lean? I cant hear anything and exhaust flange nuts are tight. No audible pinging that I can really hear although my pipes are louder than most probably. I am kinda at a loss on this one.
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From: tn
As far as Im aware the power vision running the standard 02 sensors wont measure the AFR correctly but I could be wrong. But rpm is in the 3-3200 range. Seems to get worse as heads get warmer gets up in the 350s as far as head temps go pulling some of these big hills around here at 80-85. My tune isnt set up to pull timing on head temp until 375 and even then it starts in the 80-100 kpa range. Also have noticed some pretty good decel pop here lately so hoping maybe its an exhaust gasket issue. Boy I hate pulling this rear pipe the bottom but is a pain in the *** to get to but I guess exhaust gaskets it is this weekend. We will see if maybe that will help.
Last edited by shrekmoose; May 9, 2019 at 03:42 AM.
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From: tn
I have been looking at the logs there doesnt seem to be anything out of the ordinary. Thats whats causing me to go back to thinking either plugs which it prob needs anyhow or exhaust gaskets. It seems to have been gradually getting worse which would make sense if it was a gasket being blown further and further out.
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If you have aftermarket (screwtop) sparkplugs and/or aftermarket wires, you can expect “false knock” reporting which, in turn, causes unnecessary ignition retard. The problem with this condition is you can be riding down the road and sometimes feel the engine isn
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Just a guess, but do you have aftermarket (screwtop) sparkplugs installed? How ‘bout wires?
If you have anything but stock sparkplugs and wires “false knock” can and will rear it’s ugly head and falsely retard ignition timing which, in turn, kills up to 10 hp (max = 12 degs) on the spot. Once the ignition is recycled the system resets thinking you got “good” gas and the system promptly goes back to work learning false knock reporting and retarding timing thinking it’s detonating...which it’s not.
Let us know what you find,
Bob
If you have anything but stock sparkplugs and wires “false knock” can and will rear it’s ugly head and falsely retard ignition timing which, in turn, kills up to 10 hp (max = 12 degs) on the spot. Once the ignition is recycled the system resets thinking you got “good” gas and the system promptly goes back to work learning false knock reporting and retarding timing thinking it’s detonating...which it’s not.
Let us know what you find,
Bob
Last edited by FLTRI17; May 10, 2019 at 10:49 AM.
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From: florida
whithout knowing more info than what you have posted up (such as exact afr and rpm, throttle position and map reading, at event) you are most likely going to chase your tail. you might consider getting to a local and reputable dyno tuning shop and have them do some testing to help you pin down your issue. if your actual afr is too lean, if your acceration enrichment is off, etc. you could spend a lot of time chasing your tail looking for an ignition issue that isn't there.
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As far as Im aware the power vision running the standard 02 sensors wont measure the AFR correctly but I could be wrong. But rpm is in the 3-3200 range. Seems to get worse as heads get warmer gets up in the 350s as far as head temps go pulling some of these big hills around here at 80-85. My tune isnt set up to pull timing on head temp until 375 and even then it starts in the 80-100 kpa range. Also have noticed some pretty good decel pop here lately so hoping maybe its an exhaust gasket issue. Boy I hate pulling this rear pipe the bottom but is a pain in the *** to get to but I guess exhaust gaskets it is this weekend. We will see if maybe that will help.
@ 155249 the ECU is trimming fuel because my O2 sensor has measured a different figure (actual) from the figure in my AFR table (target). It is also pulling 4 degrees of timing.
@ 156616 the ECU is adding fuel because my O2 sensor has measured a different figure (actual) from the figure in my AFR table (target). Again, it is also pulling 2.5 degrees of timing.
Example below:
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From: tn
Spark plugs are factory. Acceleration enrichment was turned off in the fuel moto map I got I do believe. From top of my head the majority of the knock is occurring in the 20-24 percent throttle. 56-60 Kpa in between 30-3200 rpm. If its a lean condition then the exhaust gasket would make sense as its way worse in the front cylinder in both my decel pop and pulling timing. Im assuming anyhow due to reversion in the pipe letting fresh air from the bad gasket into the cylinder.
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