Power Vision Information Thread
Cruiser
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 161
Likes: 0
From: Hampton Roads, VA
after reading the PV literature about PC import tunes, do not seem like the best way to go unless maybe you have a proven PC tune developed for your bike. I think that in its current form the PV is a great way to load a pre-made or canned tune to the ECM and to datalog, but not a good tuner for the novice without a Dyno to try to self-tune their bike.
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Extreme HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 11,615
Likes: 50
From: Baton Rouge, LA
The log-tuner software is in beta now, but I don't know when it will be released. Since that's a topic of importance to many I'll post as soon as I hear something, and the same goes for the new FW and WinPV versions that are also still in beta.
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Extreme HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 11,615
Likes: 50
From: Baton Rouge, LA
Iclick. Dont mess with where the timing is being actually pulled. Look a record or two BEFORE the ECM pulls timing. Bus speed AND Vision speed is slower than the actual event that made the timing get pulled in the first place. By the time you see a record of timing being pulled... the event that forced that is past. See?
THIS is why I do NOT like canned maps... and I don't care WHO does em. Each bike IS different a teeny bit.
Iclick... you ain't no PC guy anymore... GOOD!!!
Last edited by iclick; Apr 5, 2011 at 08:52 AM.
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Extreme HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 11,615
Likes: 50
From: Baton Rouge, LA
So far my average mileage after flashing the Fuel Moto tune to my ECM is 41.7 MPG. Prior to installing the new tune I averaged 42 MPG. I have been riding the same as I always have, to the same places I always go.
Overall, I think the bike runs/accelerates much smoother than before I got the PV and Fuel Moto tune. After riding during a couple of 90 degree days this week, I do not think that it runs any cooler than with my Stage 1 download. I still have some hunting/surging in 2nd + 3rd gear at low RPM that I would like to get rid of.
Overall, I think the bike runs/accelerates much smoother than before I got the PV and Fuel Moto tune. After riding during a couple of 90 degree days this week, I do not think that it runs any cooler than with my Stage 1 download. I still have some hunting/surging in 2nd + 3rd gear at low RPM that I would like to get rid of.
Cruiser
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 228
Likes: 0
From: Texas
I have e-mailed Jamie @ Fuelmoto twice now (no response yet other than the automated e-mail letting me know they received my e-mail) and asked for help with the problem. I am waiting to hear their advice before I start changing things on my own. I would rather have a "Performance" type MAP than an "Economy" type MAP. Fuel mileage doesn't matter much to me. I want my bike to run well.
Last edited by 883_dave; Apr 4, 2011 at 06:21 PM. Reason: typo
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Extreme HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 11,615
Likes: 50
From: Baton Rouge, LA
I have e-mailed Jamie @ Fuelmoto twice now (no response yet other than the automated e-mail letting me know they received my e-mail) and asked for help with the problem. I am waiting to hear their advice before I start changing things on my own. I would rather have a "Performance" type MAP rather than an "Economy" type MAP. Fuel mileage doesn't matter much to me. I want a well running bike.
Cruiser
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 228
Likes: 0
From: Texas
Your "economy" tune won't hurt performance, as the key to economy is keeping the cruise-range reasonably lean. Above that is the performance range and I don't try to lean anything above about 60% TP. My theory is that when I'm at cruise I'm getting optimal mileage, but when I nail it I don't want compromises. If your only complaint is some surging at low speeds, that can be fixed without affecting mileage much, nor will it affect performance.
I am such a novice when it comes to EFI that am not yet comfortable making changes without advice from someone who knows EFI tuning well. I am glad that I purchased my PV from Fuelmoto. I doubt that many of the other online retailers of the PV would provide the kind of service FM does after the sale. I am sure that FM is very busy and flooded with e-mails right now with all of the new tuning devices and riding season for many just starting. Jamie still took the time to help me with my problem.
Advanced
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 82
Likes: 1
From: Idaho Falls, ID
I purchased a PV form Jamie and the Fuel Moto team last week to replace a PCV w/AT-100.
Jamie must be swamped because he is backed up on emails.
So my question to the group is: Do I need to remove the terminator caps for the o2 sensor wiring that was put in place for the PCV and re install the stock o2 sensors, or can I leave everything in place (minus the PCV) for when the AT feature is enabled in the PV firmware?
Thanks,
Cheiron
Jamie must be swamped because he is backed up on emails.
So my question to the group is: Do I need to remove the terminator caps for the o2 sensor wiring that was put in place for the PCV and re install the stock o2 sensors, or can I leave everything in place (minus the PCV) for when the AT feature is enabled in the PV firmware?
Thanks,
Cheiron
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Extreme HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 11,615
Likes: 50
From: Baton Rouge, LA
So my question to the group is: Do I need to remove the terminator caps for the o2 sensor wiring that was put in place for the PCV and re install the stock o2 sensors, or can I leave everything in place (minus the PCV) for when the AT feature is enabled in the PV firmware?
Here is one of the most helpful posts that I have read, when it comes to working with tables and values in the WinPV software. I am re-posting Jamie's quote for everyone's benefit, and also to lead to my next question...
In the AFR tables, higher values mean leaner mixtures. But in the VE tables, higher values would be richer. So in the WinPV software, the AFR table is a sub-section of the "Fuel" tune items. And the VE table is a sub-section of the "Airflow" tune items. Seems like they should be reversed, IMO.
If you raise values in VE, you're adding "FUEL", If you raise values in AFR, you're adding "AIR"... well, kinda?... Oh well, no biggie, sounded good in my head. Steevo
The main tables you want to work with for changing the mixture are the VE tables which are a representation of the airflow model. You are directly altering the fuel delivery as the VE is a command function for the ECM. On the other hand the AFR/Lambda tables are used to calculate the mixture as a target, ideally the VE table should be synchronized to the specific AFR/Lambda defined in the table, these tables are also used as a control function if you are operating in closed loop. Small changes made in the AFR/Lambda tables are generally going to be insignifigant, for example if you change from lambda of .984 to lambda of say .960 you have only changes the mixture by about .3 of an AFR point, a higher Lambda value is leaner lower is richer. A lambda value of 1 is always stoich for a given fuel. Also note closed loop operation is only active from .977-1.02 Lambda so if you are requesting a mixture leaner or richer there will not be closed loop feedback. Hope this info helps.
If you raise values in VE, you're adding "FUEL", If you raise values in AFR, you're adding "AIR"... well, kinda?... Oh well, no biggie, sounded good in my head. Steevo