2018 M8----Sumping? Failures?

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Dec 29, 2018 | 06:10 PM

#401

Cazador

Member

Joined: Oct 2015

Posts: 7,289

Likes: 3,323

From: TN

Has anyone had a S&S or a Fueling pump installed and then have a sumping problem?

Dec 29, 2018 | 06:14 PM

#402

Heatwave

Member

Joined: Jul 2009

Posts: 4,310

Likes: 1,079

Quote:

Originally Posted by bradsULtd

Not a fact just because you say so...

You are absolutely correct. It is NOT a fact just because I say so. Its a fact because those living in the real world can read the posts for themselves.

Dec 29, 2018 | 06:16 PM

#403

mjwebb

Seasoned HDF Member

Joined: Jan 2008

Posts: 13,674

Likes: 11,462

From: State of Confusion

would be great if all these forums had a Sticky Thread called..'Post a pic of your R.O. for Sumping', or..'Pics or it didn't happen' or sumping like dat..would filter out a lot of the internet reporting legitimacy debates

Dec 29, 2018 | 06:17 PM

#404

Heatwave

Member

Joined: Jul 2009

Posts: 4,310

Likes: 1,079

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cazador

Has anyone had a S&S or a Fueling pump installed and then have a sumping problem?

Yes, there were several posts of a guy that sumped with the S&S oil pump. S&S said that their oil pump was not a solution for a bike that was sumping before their pump was installed. Not sure if it was on CVOHarley or HTT.

Dec 29, 2018 | 06:52 PM

#405

Steve Cole

HD EFI Guru

Joined: Jan 2008

Posts: 4,490

Likes: 4,776

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cazador

Has anyone had a S&S or a Fueling pump installed and then have a sumping problem?

BOTH Feuling and S&S have stated there new M8 oil pumps are NOT to solve sumping, I have personally talked with them both. There have been a few end users that stated they helped and others who stated it did not. The truth is not even the latest HD seal plate is working across the board, it helps but does not solve it for all. That said, at this point in time the best you can do is use the HD pump with the seal plate as that is much cheaper than the others and the seal plate currently only works with the HD pump. Sumping is a real deal and I've stated that since back in 2016 when we had our first M8 one do it. ALL M8 models can and do sump but until the real cause if found and fixed were all just guessing as to why. I've shared with all of you what we have done to fix it, but with only 5 engines that sumped before we added the changes and do not, after our changes, that's not a large enough sample IMHO to call it solved. Believe it or not is up to each of you.

This is no different than the Transmission transfer issue, they do not have a clue as to why, but it does happen. They told me it's due to my riding style but when I asked why do only my M8 bikes do it, and why does one do it much more than the other (I've got two of them)? They tucked there tail and walked away as they know I own several other HD bikes as well. HD has been burying there head in the sand for three years now and to this point they have been trying to push the blame on the consumer, instead of stepping up to the plate on BOTH the sumping and transfer issues. Time will tell how that works out for them but looking at new unit sales and the stock prices as of late, it maybe just catching up with them.

As for Heatwave, let's just say he is what he is and let it go at that!

Last edited by Steve Cole; Dec 29, 2018 at 07:02 PM. Reason: spelling

Dec 29, 2018 | 07:45 PM

#406

Oz Dan

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Joined: Jun 2017

Posts: 494

Likes: 220

From: Qld, Australia

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Cole

ALL M8 models can and do sump but until the real cause if found and fixed were all just guessing as to why.

I recall you discussing some of your early test m8’s that had the earliest original oil pumps......you dynoed/test rode them numerous times with various cam combinations........yet none sumped as I remember, because your comment was something like “so how bad could the original oil pumps be?

How bad indeed. Seems to me that the oil pump wasn’t the problem. I think it does lend support to the idea that if you have a non sumping bike proven over many miles and conditions you probably have other things to worry about.

Dec 29, 2018 | 10:04 PM

#407

Steve Cole

HD EFI Guru

Joined: Jan 2008

Posts: 4,490

Likes: 4,776

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oz Dan

You are correct. We built a 120 cu in combination back in early 2017 with an original 107 bike that had a Aug 2016 build date and it did not sump in over 5000 miles of testing. We used the original oil pump with no custom modification to the oil pump. That bike has had many different combinations, cams and heads on/in it and it was always fine. My RK also has a Aug 16 build date and it's never sumped but has transmission Transfer issues. IMHO chasing the oil pump was a waste of time as none of the newer ones fixed the issue. The new back plate with seal seems to help so I have one coming, so when I go back into the RK I will add it. as it's cheap insurance. IMHO HD should at least supply one free of charge to any M8 built without it.