Se 120r complete engine?
Member
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 4,310
Likes: 1,079
It seems like a step back to the 1920s when I have to constantly adjust the tune of a bike real time like they did way back in the '20s while driving; adjusting timing advance and fuel constantly. I doubt that the majority of people riding a Harley want instant access to tune their bike on the fly. However there will be some of us who just have to tinker with it constantly to get that extra 1hp out of her.
I don't see myself riding down the road thinking damn I need just 2 more lbs of torques so I can make it over this hill.
I don't see myself riding down the road thinking damn I need just 2 more lbs of torques so I can make it over this hill.
You make it sound like the the guys in the 1920's didn't enjoy modifying their cars. They did. Where do you think the roadsters of the 30's/40's came from?....from guys like those on this thread that wanted more power than the original manufacturer either designed or intended for their vehicles.
In this modern age of nanny-state governments that think they must protect us from ourselves, this is one of the last bastions to say screw the gov. I for one, get pleasure out of modifying my boat engine, bike engine and car engine for the sheer joy of telling the Obama EPA to kiss my A** while I upgrade my engine to a reliable but higher performance level than the EPA would have ever allowed the manufacturer to release.
For the guys that lift up their car's hood and can't tell the difference between a fuel injector and a spark plug, I suggest they stick with their harley engine just the way it came from the factory. That's probably the safest bet for these types of riders. Nothing wrong with it as it probably represents 90% of the owners. For these guys that need protection from themselves, they have a wonderful bunch of bureaucrats looking out for them in DC.
For the rest of us, let's upgrade and ride!
"Seeker of Freedom"
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,093
Likes: 2
From: Kansas City Area
If every Harley owner thought like your post above, there would be no need for any of these tuning products, or 120R engines or Jim's engine upgrades or Woods Cams or any other HD engine upgrade.
You make it sound like the the guys in the 1920's didn't enjoy modifying their cars. They did. Where do you think the roadsters of the 30's/40's came from?....from guys like those on this thread that wanted more power than the original manufacturer either designed or intended for their vehicles.
In this modern age of nanny-state governments that think they must protect us from ourselves, this is one of the last bastions to say screw the gov. I for one, get pleasure out of modifying my boat engine, bike engine and car engine for the sheer joy of telling the Obama EPA to kiss my A** while I upgrade my engine to a reliable but higher performance level than the EPA would have ever allowed the manufacturer to release.
For the guys that lift up their car's hood and can't tell the difference between a fuel injector and a spark plug, I suggest they stick with their harley engine just the way it came from the factory. That's probably the safest bet for these types of riders. Nothing wrong with it as it probably represents 90% of the owners. For these guys that need protection from themselves, they have a wonderful bunch of bureaucrats looking out for them in DC.
For the rest of us, let's upgrade and ride!
You make it sound like the the guys in the 1920's didn't enjoy modifying their cars. They did. Where do you think the roadsters of the 30's/40's came from?....from guys like those on this thread that wanted more power than the original manufacturer either designed or intended for their vehicles.
In this modern age of nanny-state governments that think they must protect us from ourselves, this is one of the last bastions to say screw the gov. I for one, get pleasure out of modifying my boat engine, bike engine and car engine for the sheer joy of telling the Obama EPA to kiss my A** while I upgrade my engine to a reliable but higher performance level than the EPA would have ever allowed the manufacturer to release.
For the guys that lift up their car's hood and can't tell the difference between a fuel injector and a spark plug, I suggest they stick with their harley engine just the way it came from the factory. That's probably the safest bet for these types of riders. Nothing wrong with it as it probably represents 90% of the owners. For these guys that need protection from themselves, they have a wonderful bunch of bureaucrats looking out for them in DC.
For the rest of us, let's upgrade and ride!
Don't get me wrong this is an awesome product and makes it much easier to get back to the days when you could tune your own bike. I just don't think the masses will see the instant tuning mounted on the handlebars a requirement for a good tuner. Most will be content to get the bike base tuned and have the ability to make adjustments after the days ride is over if they see the need.
PS.20s references was not to modifications; I was talking about a time when you had to adjust the timing and fuel mixture as a standard feature just to keep the thing running. There was levers and such on the cars for these adjustments. I may have got the era a little off.
Last edited by itsaw0rkinpr0gre$$; Nov 16, 2010 at 11:39 AM.
Member
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 4,310
Likes: 1,079
Maybe I wasn't clear, not saying people don't want to modify thier Harley; obviously they do or these products wouldn't exist. I'm suggesting that a product that allows this level of instant adjustability isn't required for most of us on the fly. Most riders just need one solid tune and the ability to adjust it without getting it dynoed every time. I don't see the masses rushing out to buy a product like this to mount on thier classic styled bike so they can monitor it like it's a race bike. Harley riders in general want to enjoy the ride not tune the bike. They don't want to be tuning it at every stop they make.
Don't get me wrong this is an awesome product and makes it much easier to get back to the days when you could tune your own bike. I just don't think the masses will see the instant tuning mounted on the handlebars a requirement for a good tuner. Most will be content to get the bike base tuned and have the ability to make adjustments after the days ride is over if they see the need.
PS.20s references was not to modifications; I was talking about a time when you had to adjust the timing and fuel mixture as a standard feature just to keep the thing running. There was levers and such on the cars for these adjustments. I may have got the era a little off.
Don't get me wrong this is an awesome product and makes it much easier to get back to the days when you could tune your own bike. I just don't think the masses will see the instant tuning mounted on the handlebars a requirement for a good tuner. Most will be content to get the bike base tuned and have the ability to make adjustments after the days ride is over if they see the need.
PS.20s references was not to modifications; I was talking about a time when you had to adjust the timing and fuel mixture as a standard feature just to keep the thing running. There was levers and such on the cars for these adjustments. I may have got the era a little off.
I'm not sure if you're seeing the "possibilities" at least as I'm envisioning. Imagine that after tuning with the PV and storing various different maps that you've tuned, that you could do the following:
- Change to a map that you previously developed for running on 89 octane when you're caught at a "poor" gas station. Now you would have a custom map for your bike that potentially adjusts for lower octane yet still maximizes performance, fuel economy or both and avoids knocking.
- Change to a different map that's developed for riding 2up vs single rider while accommodating for timing/VEs to maximize performance or economy for different bike loads.
- Change to richer maps when riding in the summer to have a more comfortable ride on your air cooled engine in hot weather.
- Change to a leaner map to maximize fuel economy for the long haul touring ride or when riding in cool weather.
- Changing to a max performance map when the "need" arises.
Either way, within 6-12 months of the launch of this device, we'll know which way the market prefers. My guess is that the other tuning approaches will quickly follow the PV approach with potentially even more user friendly advantages ...or not....and they will go away.
Last edited by Heatwave; Nov 16, 2010 at 04:08 PM.
Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 6,146
Likes: 471
From: along the Front Range in Colorado
...... well ?
..... somebody ?
......... anybody ?
....... ok, well, then .. i guess i'm on my own ...... ............... let's ride ! .....
"Seeker of Freedom"
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,093
Likes: 2
From: Kansas City Area
Heatwave, i can see the need for additional custom maps for those type scenarios if they were available at the push of a button. I still don't know that I want that type of display on my streetglide. A gps is pushing it , now you want to add another screen. It does make it convenient to pop on and change the map if needed. I'm hoping that in general a good tune combined with the sophistication built into the stock computer will be good enough for 98% of the situations I run into.
This would be a great device to have on one of those ironbutt rides across the nation where fuel economy is king.
This would be a great device to have on one of those ironbutt rides across the nation where fuel economy is king.
"Seeker of Freedom"
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,093
Likes: 2
From: Kansas City Area
Intermediate
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 35
Likes: 0
From: at the bottom of the world, just a rocks though from the ice
Heatwave will lol
This is the best laugh ive had for quite sometime, F U C K big brother, F U C K the state, F U C K the EPA
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"Seeker of Freedom"
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,093
Likes: 2
From: Kansas City Area
Picking mine up tomorrow and will do the breakin over the weekend unless we get some bad weather. First run on dyno is 132hp/129tq with base map. I'll get the final tune next Tuesday and post up the sheets.
SE120R Kit not Crate
SE roller rockers
SE 58mm throttle body
SE high flow injectors
SE Race Clutch
D&D BossZilla Chrome
SE Heavy Breather
Installed by Bluesprings Harley-Davindson of Bluesprings, MO
SE120R Kit not Crate
SE roller rockers
SE 58mm throttle body
SE high flow injectors
SE Race Clutch
D&D BossZilla Chrome
SE Heavy Breather
Installed by Bluesprings Harley-Davindson of Bluesprings, MO