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Sep 22, 2015 | 09:00 PM

#7661

Coug

Intermediate

Joined: Mar 2014

Posts: 30

Likes: 0

From: WA

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yookdew

Thanks for the advice. I'll give it a try manually inputting the VE's in those cells.

Once I manually input the VE's and go on some more autotune runs, do I just continue to manually adjust those cells back down every few autotunes until I get less than 5% change in the VE's?

That's what I'd do. The only problem is you'll only know if you get to that point of less than 5% change if you compare in WinPV, the PV will still report those big VEs. You could also try tuning at a min MAP of 35 KPa and see what happens - make sure you start with your base map if you autotune with the higher min MAP though.

Just for info, I'm running an '04 with HTCC heads, high compression, cams, 2-1, with an autotune pro set up... so I feel for ya, no closed loop, and almost nothing for canned maps...

Sep 22, 2015 | 09:07 PM

#7662

Yookdew

Intermediate

Joined: Jul 2012

Posts: 40

Likes: 1

From: Knoxville, TN

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coug

I din't think about having to maually check the changes in Winpv but that makes sense and is not a big deal to do.

Thanks for all the help that everybody has given me on this issue. I understand the basics of tuning but this problem was definitely over my head. Hopefully I'll have some time tomorrow evening to give this a try and I'll repor back my results.

Sep 22, 2015 | 10:44 PM

#7663

sloufoot

Club Member

Joined: Jan 2012

Posts: 26,411

Likes: 4,101

From: Southeast Idaho

You need to keep in mind the "canned map" is just fodder for tuning. Find one close to your configuration then tune it to fit your system.
There isn't a perfect canned map for any set-up.
Something I have used before when fighting reversion is the "torque cones". They go in at the head in the header & stop the reversion. Cheap fix for machined inserts. Don't get the stamped out ones.

Sep 23, 2015 | 10:26 AM

#7664

oldhippie

Stellar HDF Member

Joined: Jun 2007

Posts: 2,928

Likes: 117

From: Ashby, Ma

Quote:

Originally Posted by Makdaddy

This is discouraging
Im on the fence
I have a PCV and autotune.
But I want to monitor AFR while I ride (Real Time)
My options are
#1 POD 300 added to my current system
#2 Innovate Motorsports DLG-1 gauge install and pull the autotune
#3 Trade my PCV for a Vision and maybe upgrade to the Target tune.

I was really leaning toward Option 3 till I read the above quoted post.

If the PV only lasts a few years Im prob gonna do option 2
I know the Gauge in the dash will outlive the 02 sensors.

Anyone else experience issues with the PV having problems after 2 years?

I will admit I had a PCiii fail on me after about 7 years, and at that time Jaime at FeulMoto gave me the PV at a Major discount to replace the PCiii that had failed, totally out of warranty.

Since then I have been just about living in this thread, to learn as much as possible about PVs and tuning, and the amount ot PVs I've heard of failing in all that time I could count on 1 hand. Most of the failures even being questionable/vague problems.

PVs, in my opinion based on how "in touch" I am with the device from all the posts here, are VERY reliable.

Last edited by oldhippie; Sep 24, 2015 at 08:19 PM.

Sep 24, 2015 | 03:11 PM

#7665

adkg12

Cruiser

Joined: Jul 2015

Posts: 101

Likes: 2

From: Columbus, Ohio, USA

So .. I have been reading till my eyes are bleeding...I am a new PV owner.. and I really like it so far.. I have read here often about getting you VE tables dialed in.. but I cant seem find out how you can tell when they are.. I mean.. I have ran auto tune many time.. export.. flash.. repeat.. What am I looking for as an indicator that I am as good as I am gonna get.. ? I am having a little bit of a bogging feeling as I roll on the throttle kind of hard at about 35%-45% throttle and 1800-2500 Rpm.. not sure what to change to fix that either.. ! LOL But I am learning..
Thanks
Glen

Sep 24, 2015 | 08:01 PM

#7666

tstroud

Tourer

Joined: Aug 2013

Posts: 289

Likes: 9

From: Iowa

When you export it tells you the maximum VE change. When you get below 5% you are done.

Sep 24, 2015 | 08:28 PM

#7667

oldhippie

Stellar HDF Member

Joined: Jun 2007

Posts: 2,928

Likes: 117

From: Ashby, Ma

Quote:

Originally Posted by adkg12

Glen, you need to save your Autotunes on your PC, then do an Autotune, and save that tune also on the PC. Then, using WinPV, you bring up the initial tune and then using the compare feature you bring up the 2nd "Autotune". You then go to the Compare menu and on the pull downs there is a "Show Delta as Percent" feature. Check that and then compare your initial tune to the current AT you just did. They will change less and less as you do a few. Until finally you are getting differences from one to the next below 5%. Then you are done with Autotunes.

If you are dealing with any decel popping or other issues, like the lag you mentioned, you then can deal with those through various techniques you can learn here. For instance, this lag you are feeling might show up as an anomally in Datalogging you can do and then look at the area you feel the lag, RPMS, throttle position etc. On some of this stuff, call FuelMoto if you bought the device from them, or Dynojet if not, and ask for some tech support. They'll look at your tune and listen to your problem and suggest changes to your map you can try.

Sep 24, 2015 | 08:32 PM

#7668

ke5rbd

Road Warrior

Joined: Apr 2010

Posts: 1,648

Likes: 37

From: Monroe, Louisiana

Quote:

Originally Posted by adkg12

You will probably have to contact Dynajet and find out how to get the stumble out at 1800 to 2500 rpm. You aren't the first one that has happened to. If you feel adventuresome and have a TPS based VE you can increase the VE's above 15% throttle 5% or if it is Map Kpa based VE table you can increase it above 45% in the 1800 to 2500 Rpms. Then don't accept any changes Auto tune makes in that area. It will mess it up again.

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Sep 24, 2015 | 08:44 PM

#7669

whittlebeast

Road Master

Joined: Mar 2007

Posts: 1,177

Likes: 23

Quote:

Originally Posted by adkg12

This is what near perfection looks like for fueling. All of this graphing is all done with the program MegaLogViewer HD. On the first two shots, you want the entire left side to be as near to 100 as possible. On the right, you want nearly a straight line.

Speed density on the left

http://www.nbs-stl.com/HarleyTuning/...Perfection.png

Throttle based tuning Alpha-N

http://www.nbs-stl.com/HarleyTuning/...rfectionAN.png

And Speed Density compared to Alpha-N

http://www.nbs-stl.com/HarleyTuning/...rfectionVE.png

Andy

Last edited by whittlebeast; Sep 24, 2015 at 08:46 PM.

Sep 25, 2015 | 06:22 AM

#7670

whittlebeast

Road Master

Joined: Mar 2007

Posts: 1,177

Likes: 23

This is what being on the edge everywhere with timing looks like. Slight knock detection almost everywhere on a big log. That is about 75 min of data. I think I would have the owner remove about a degree of timing over the entire map and see if he can feel a difference. Trying better fuel for a tank may also help him learn something about what the motor wants.

http://www.nbs-stl.com/HarleyTuning/...Perfection.png

Have fun tuning

Andy